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HomeMy WebLinkAboutSubmittal- Commissioner Sarnoff-Sept. 2013 Commission Meeting MinutesCity Commission Meeting Minutes September 26, 2013 ce T— C Q Commissioner Suarez: (UNINTELLIGIBLE) spoke to the Mayor. 1 get half the credit for that. Mr. Ortiz: Huh? Commissioner Suarez: I get half the credit for that (UNINTELLIGIBLE) Mr. Ortiz: What do you mean? Commissioner Suarez: I get half the credit for that. He doesn't get -- take full credit for that. Mr. Ortiz: Well, you know what? I do thank you for getting out of the race, 'cause you gave me halfa million dollars. I do appreciate that. Commissioner Suarez: (UNINTELLIGIBLE) credit for (UNINTELLIGIBLE). Mr. Ortiz: Thank you. Anyway, I'm going to get beaten up for that. We don't have parity with the other unions. I know that somebody was saying that. We don't have parity. And I'm just trying to come in line with the Fire Department. That's all I'm trying to do. This plan is feasible, but the only way it's feasible, Commissioner Gort, is by allocating the money today. We allocate the money today. I can meet with Mr. Manager tomorrow. Next week you have your executive session, and 1 think it's a no-brainer. This is totally doable. But just remember, when you're looking at hiring, you're going to hire, but you're -- I just -- off the bat, I just told you you're going to lose at least 35 people between DROP and resignations, and there's more corruption coming, unfortunately. We got to clean that up, and we got to hire better applicants. Fifty thousand is what the County makes, not 44; 57 when you look at the add-ons in Miami Beach; they're hiring. My plan asks for 5.4 million. It's not all coming from the City. It's things that we would give up. Yes, it is -- some of it is one-time money, Mr. Manager. We are all going to have to negotiate new contracts. When it comes to Fire, their step raises are frozen. That's going to be recurring also. We've spoken about -- informally about, you know, we have to put the City back on track, meaning the Police Department, when it comes to step raises and all that. So you're going to have a recurring expense, but revenues will continue to go up. I totally understand what Commissioner Suarez is saying when it comes to pension cost. The FOP was right; the City was wrong. This is the second time this happened. We said how much it was going to be, and what did the City do? Instead of just keeping the budget high for that issue, for that item, they said, "Nah, we'll be all right," and they lowered it. And now, it's eaten up a lot of our new revenue. So I'm ready to work with you guys. I'm willing to work with you guys. I'm willing to work with the Manager. I'm not going to take this personal. You want to say that I refused to meet with you. I haven't refused, but guess what? I'm not going to meet until the money is allocated, because that's when we do business, and that will be tomorrow at 2 p.m. Thank you. Commissioner Suarez: So how many police officers are we going to have and how are we going to pay for it? Chair Sarnoff So under the -- Commissioner Carollo: Well, my count right now, it's not -- we have -- we're going to have 95 patrol officers on the street. That's my count. And the way 1 get to that count is 20 -- Commissioner Suarez: I gotcha. Commissioner Carollo: -- that are in different -- Commissioner Suarez: They're assigned. City of Miami Page 68 1 Primed on 10'21 2013 /f! Slo - 11;41- Co��,lSSI©hcr n r0fR T , 2O/3 co_immISS,a me , n9 f'1in vl s City Commission Meeting Minutes September 26, 2013 Commissioner Carollo: -- positions right now or different non -patrolling assignments which will be now assigned to go to the streets and patrol. There is, last I heard, 40 vacancies, which the Chief said by the end of the year will be filled There's an additional 35 in the proposal from the Manager and the Mayor. And if my math is correct, 40 plus 20 plus 35 is 95 officers that will be patrolling the streets that right now are not patrolling the streets. Commissioner Suarez: Andjust to be clear -- That's how many; 95, you said? Commissioner Carollo: Ninety-five additional patrol officers. Commissioner Suarez: And just to be clear, a portion of that, 12 or so, is predicated on a COPS (Community Oriented Policing Services) grant. Commissioner Carollo: I'm sorry? Commissioner Suarez: Twelve -- half, approximately, of the 25 that were budgeted -- Commissioner Carollo: Thirty -jive. Commissioner Suarez: No, no, 25. The original 25 -- before we came up with the new 10, the origina125, approximately half -- Mr. Manager, go ahead. Mr. Alfonso: Okay. Commissioners, in the original budget proposal -- Commissioner Suarez: Right. Mr. Alfonso: -- there were 25 police officers in addition. The revised proposal added 10 new officers, so that's a total of 35 new officers. In discussion with the Police Chief we agreed that if we could backfill with civilians, which cost money -- and in fairness to the Chief when these issues were discussed in the past, he was asked, "How many folks can you move out there?" And he did 33. It wasn't taken into account, "1 could do more if you give me civilians." We weren't discussing doing civilians at the time. Commissioner Carollo: Right. Mr. Alfonso: So right now we have said that if we add now -- and in our proposal, we had 10 civilians and he had identified 15 officers that could move out. So you have the net 35 new, and you have 15 that are currently in the department that would move out; 5 of them immediately; the other 10 as we backfill with civilians. And today, the Chief has said that if he's given more civilians, he can identiA another 5 positions. However, that would also require funding for those 5 civilians. Chief Orosa: Andjust to reiterate what the Manager says, what I said before still stands today. Before, I wasn't given the leeway of backfilling with civilians. That's why I did the 33, and I said, "I can't do anymore." Now we have the leeway of filling with civilians, and 1 can fill the 10 the " s, Manager has said he can give me; any more, which I think is maybe 5 more, it would necessitate 7 3 more civilians. Q = w 4, u Commissioner Suarez: Can 1-- o a� C ▪ C 0 Vice Chair Gort: Total numbers, total numbers. - ✓ C 4 Commissioner Spence -Jones: So we're at 95, no? E G C1 Mr. Alfonso: But that would be -- City °MMiami Page 69 Printed on 10'21 2013 0 0 City Commission Meeting Minutes September 26, 2013 Commissioner Carollo: Ninety-five. Mr. Afonso: Ninety-five if you include the 40 vacancies that were in the budget — Commissioner Carollo: That right now -- Mr. Alfonso: — or in the — Commissioner Carollo: — are not patrolling our streets. Mr. Alfonso: Correct. Commissioner Suarez: Now, what's the expected attrition next year? Mr. Alfonso: There are, 1 believe, around 19 or 17 people that are expected to leave due to the DROP. Mr. Ortiz: It's 15. Chair Sarnoff So that you net 75. Commissioner Carollo: Seventy-eight. Mr. Alfonso: And Commissioners, I want to say it is -- Commissioner Carollo: Gives me 17. Mr. Alfonso: -- almost a virtual impossibility for any -- Chair Sarnoff You're right, you're right. Mr. Alfonso: -- department ever to be at 100 percent staffing. If you have a three person department, yes. If you have a 1,500-person organization, to have zero attrition, it's almost impossible. Commissioner Suarez: No, not that you have zero attrition, but you have people queued up so that when you lose somebody, you're able to replace them immediately, like, you know, within a week. Chief Orosa: And Commissioner, that's part of what I have -- I don't want to say "created," but what we've started; that we are in a constant hiring mode, no matter what the numbers are, no matter if the money is budgeted or not. I know that I'm going to be losing 17 next year. I'll probably lose another 15 because they decide to leave early or we -- Commissioner Suarez: Right. Chief Orosa: -- they get fired or whatever the reason is, so I always want to be in a constant hiring mode. Commissioner Suarez: That's business experience. That's business experience. Chief Orosa: No matter whether the money is there or not, we have to be in that mode. We cannot stop the machinery, wait for the money, and then hire. City of Miami Page 70 Printed on 10/21/2013 - O! U ram+ V City Commission Meeting Minutes September 26, 2013 Commissioner Suarez: And 1 think, philosophically, we've come a long way, a long way in the last two years since Commissioner Sarnoff brought this to our collective attention and then brought the whole issue of understaffing to our attention. I think, again, we've come a long way. I think you're right. 1 think you're realistic about what attrition you're going to have next year. What you're saying is probably going to be close to 30, somewhere in that vicinity, you know what I'm saying? So the net add is like 65 -- Chief Orosa: Yes. Commissioner Suarez: -- assuming we fill those positions, which is the other worry that 1 have, which is really the worry that I have. Chief Orosa: I don't -- I really don't worry that, because every time we open an application process, we open it for about a week and we get about 1,000 candidates. Out of that, we get, like I said -- Commissioner Suarez: Fifty. You said 50 last time. Chief Orosa: -- 50, 60. Commissioner Suarez: Right. Chief Orosa: But now we're in the situation where we're not going to wait. We're going to continue to do a list. As soon as we think that list is going to expire, we're going to start with a new one. And the same way, we're not going to wait for money to continue the hiring process, because we know that attrition, it's going to kill it. Chair Sarnoff: But here's what we have: We have ostensibly a budget that will get us about 95 officers. Commissioner Carollo: Yes. Chair Sarnoff So from the standpoint of getting more cops on the street, most of us are feeling pretty good, right? Commissioner Carollo: Yes. Commissioner Suarez: If you guys say so. Is the public feeling good? That's really what matters here. Commissioner Spence -Jones: They're probably confused. Chair Sarnoff If they want to get up and say something -- Commissioner Suarez: You're the collective soul here of the public, so let's hear how the public feels. Fernand Amandi: President of the citizens collective bargaining unit. Just first and foremost, I'm in the business of doing research and studying statistical trends and then making, on the basis of those trends, decisions, strategic recommendations that end up changing things. Now, as a homeowner, I've seen three summers in a row where a crime spike seems to flare up in the summer; happened in the summer of 2010, summer of 2011, summer of 2012. We just went through one in summer 2013. Now -- Vice Chair Gort: School is out. City of Miami Page 71 Printed on 10 21 2013 Mr. Amandi: I'm talking about the budgeting of 100 more officers. So in the short term -- first off, you mentioned 15 that are going to be assigned from desk jobs -- Chief Orosa: Yes. Mr. Amandi: -- that are going to be -- What is the date certain for when that will happen? Chief Orosa: We have 5 next week and then the other 10 as soon as I can get civilians to backftll what they do right now. Mr. Amandi: Give me a sense. I'm not in the department, so I need to understand by your terms. What are those? Is that a matter of days? It should be days, right, a function of days? Chief Orosa: I'm going to refer to the Manager, because these people do not work for me right now. Mr. Amandi: Okay. Chief Orosa: They're not in my department. Mr. Alfonso: Okay, you asked how long will it take to get the civilians to backfill the officers? Mr. Amandi: The 15 officers -- Vice Chair Gort: The 95 officers, new officers, how long it will be before they'll be in the street? City of Miami Page 72 Printed on 10'21/2013 City Commission Meeting Minutes September 26, 2013 Mr. Amandi: I'm sorry? Commissioner Spence -Jones. School is out. Vice Chair Gort: School is out. Mr. Amandi: School's out, whatever. The point is, there's a clear trend line there. Now, we're talking about 95 new officers that will not be on the streets, in the Chiefs own words, for another year. Chair Sarnoff No, no, no. Commissioner Carollo: No, no, no. Commissioner Spence -Jones: But some of them are already in the pipeline. Tice Chair Gort: No, no, no. Commissioner Carollo: No, no. v Chief Orosa: If we hire 100 more officers -- a 0 Y Mr. Amandi: Right. 0 c O 4' CC c v 0 Chief Orosa: -- you're right. But by -- 0 =p -0 Commissioner Suarez: We budgeted 100 more officers, it would take us a year -- E o E .tz o u In i ++ City Commission Meeting Minutes September 26, 2013 Mr. Alfonso: Well, the answer is that there is recruitment that has to go on. The 10 civilians, the 15 civilians, they have to be recruited as well. So there are 5 that are immediately going out, because he doesn't need back for those, but the additional 15, we have to recruit for those positions. Mr. Amandi: So in other words, for the past four summers where we've experienced this, we still can't give a date certain to me, the residents, and the other residents who are here, who /d like to think in this case, we're representing in a united voice, you can't give us a date certain, simple as that. Here's the other question: In my education, if you could, please, how many -- there's 1,140 budgeted for; 1,144 for the City; is that right? Chair Sarnofff. Forty-four. Chief Orosa: Eleven forty-four. Commissioner Carollo: Eleven forty-four. Mr. Amandi: How many today are on patrol right now? Like how many are on patrol as we speak? Commissioner Suarez: And that was the question that I asked the last -- Mr. Amandi: Yeah, 1 remember you asked that last week, Commissioner Suarez. I ask the Chief how many are on patrol today? Commissioner Suarez: And 1 didn't get an answer. Mr. Amandi: Of the 1,144, how many are on patrol, and specifically, those that answer call for service and participate in the roll call? Commissioner Suarez.' Answer calls for service, I think, is the most important. Mr. Amandi: Is the designation, correct? Yeah. The answering calls for service, how many? Chief Orosa: Okay -- Commissioner Suarez: Versus uniformed officers, 'cause that's a different -- Chief Orosa: Well -- but, see, here's the little -- the fallacy around that.: We have a lot of uniformed officers that are patrolling every single day, like the PSTs that they don't go to roll call Commissioner Suarez: But they take the calls? Chief Orosa: -- like the sergeants, like the lieutenants, like mounted, like motorcycle -- Commissioner Suarez: NROs. Chief Orosa: -- they patrol, as well. Commissioner Suarez: NROs. Chief Orosa: And we are at 656. I was wrong about the 620; it's 656. In patrol right now, the optimum number was 400 to avoid overtime. When I started, we were at 340. We're at -- City of Miami Page 73 Printed on 10 212013 City Commission Meeting Minutes September 26, 2013 Commissioner Suarez: Right. 1 was -- that's the 350 number that I was told. Chief Orosa: -- three -eighty right now. Commissioner Suarez: Okay, I think what the Chair's argument had always centered around, which is what.I recall, was that we wanted to be at 700 in patrol; in other words, double our patrolling force. That was the end goal from when we started this conversation, from my perspective. Chief Orosa: Well, if you want to double the patrol, not the uniform services, the patrol -- Commissioner Suarez: Correct. Chief Orosa: -- that means that we have to empty out a lot of places; investigations, internal affairs -- Commissioner Suarez: No, 1 don't think -- no, no. Wait, wait. Listen. Commissioner Spence -Jones: Games. Chief Orosa: -- or hire a lot more. t Commissioner Spence -Jones: Games. Commissioner Suarez: That -- Listen, that's not necessarily where I'm going with it. 1 think we were talking about hiring 300 more officers, but -- Chief Orosa: Oh, okay. Commissioner Suarez: -- and that's where, I think; the hundred, plus hundred, plus hundred came into discussion. But let me just say this, 'cause Commissioner Carollo did make a good point, and we did talk a little bit about efficiency, and I did -- and, you know, and Fernand is into research, and we did -- you know, we try to pride ourselves on doing research as well and coming up with equivalent measurements. And these are reports that are published by the U.S. (United States) Bureau of Justice Statistics. When -- in a survey of local police departments in 2007, they surveyed 12,000 local law enforcement agencies with approximately 430,000 sworn officers. Overall, approximately 67 percent of local police officers had regular duties that included responding to calls for services, okay? Sixty-seven percent. In jurisdictions with 250,000 to 500,000 residents, which is the category that we happen Iola!' into, 59 percent of local officers had duties that included responding to calls for service; 59 percent of the department. So we do have to look closely at what percentage of our actual officers are responding to calls for service. It appears to me that it's closer to 40 percent, which is 20 percent less efficient than other equivalent -- Chief Orosa: But, Commissioner, what you fail to realize, calls for service are answered by motorcycles; they go by calls for service, they respond to calls for service -- Commissioner Suarez: No, I -- Chief Orosa: -- mounted does that, the PSTs always patrolling out there. Commissioner Suarez: Listen -- Chief Orosa: You know, but let's compare apples to apples. City of Miami Page 74 Printed on 10/21/2013 City Commission Meeting Minutes September 26, 2013 Commissioner Suarez: -- we've been trying to compare apples to apples here all day, okay? It's become a lot harder. It's like apples and kiwis, okay? I mean, you know, we can't even figure out how much we get paid in comparison with other jurisdictions. 1 mean, nobody can even agree on that much. We can't agree on how many officers are -- you know, I asked the question last Commission meeting and 1 never got a detailed breakdown on your number, which kind of happens to be a floating number. 1 mean, by your own admission, you said it was higher today than it was two weeks ago. . Chief Orosa: Yes. Commissioner Suarez: So, you know, my point is that we need to look at things like efficiency. How efficient are we being within our own department? But I think at the beginning of this discussion, when we started this discussion, after first ident fling the problem that we have, a hiring problem, which we are now starting to make progress on, the second issue was understaffing. And he brought -- and you did as well. You wrote a memo saying -- comparing our understaffing issues to other cities. Chief Orosa: Yes, sir. Commissioner Suarez: And he called it the best, memo that Armando's ever written. Chief Orosa: Well, 171 take a little bit of credit for that too. Unidentified Speaker: He signed it. • Commissioner Suarez: So -- I'm just giving you a hard time there, Chief. The point being that we all agreed that the -- and -- that the real challenge was we needed to get from 350, which was the magic number in my mind, to somewhere between 600 to 700 -- okay?. -- which is 250 to 350 new officers. The fact that there's this entire other category of officers that, in effect, can respond to calls for services, are on the streets, are visible, are present, 1 think that's reassuring and comforting, because 1 know how hard the NROs (Neighborhood Resource Officers) work. 1 know how hard the commanders.work, you know. They're out -- they have -- sometimes they have unmarked cars, but they're pulling people over. Chief Orosa:. Correct. Commissioner Suarez: So, , you know, they're working. It's not like they're not working. So -- but thatalso implies with the crime issue that there's a morale problem, and there clearly is. I mean, I don't think you have to go very far to see that there is; whether that means we rank number 15, whether we rank 16, when you throw in a variety of different -- and making it very difficult to compare apples to, apples, 'cause it really is, 'cause.we do -- every jurisdiction does things .differently. The,contracts are different. You know, the Manager and 1 have talked about the minutias [sic] in the con — you just can't -- it's very hard to do that. The pointis, what's indisputable is that there is a morale problem. Do you dispute that? Chief Orosa: I do not dispute that. I believe, just like you do and Javi, that there are individual officers that would like their benefits back, yes. Commissioner Spence -Jones: Yes. Commissioner Suarez: And I think it's -- ChiefOrosa: Not individual; allofficers would like their benefits back. City of. Miami Page 75 Printed on 10/21/2013 City Commission Meeting Minutes September 26, 2013 Commissioner Suarez: And 1 think it's indisputable that what we've been doing very efficiently since we got here is taking them away. Chief Orosa: Yes. Commissioner Suarez: So maybe it's time to give a little bit back Commissioner Spence -Jones: Of course. Commissioner Suarez: Okay. So we're all in agreement there. So now all we need to do is get an agreement on how many police officers we need and we're going to budget for today, and then lastly, how we're going to make sure that they get hired. Chair Sarnoff And that's why 1 thought it was a little bit simpler, because, like 1 said, 1 wasn't in favor of this budget, really, until about three or four days ago. He took $2.44 million and essentially got us now 95 police officers. Commissioner Carollo: Yes. Chair Sarnoff I'm -- that's a good spot, and I'm telling the Grove community which has turned out, that's a good spot. Doesn't mean 95 hit the street tomorrow, I candidly agree, but it does mean 25 should hit the street by Christmas, 'cause if this team can't hire civilians to do typing and stuff like that by Christmas, then we have the wrong team in place. Chief Orosa: But 25 or more. Chair Sarnoff No, 1-- candidly, great. Commissioner Suarez: 1 would not want to leave this meeting today if I were them without knowing exactly when those 95 officers are going to be on the street. Chair Sarnoff. Well -- Commissioner Suarez: And maybe you can't know exactly. Maybe that -- Mr. -- wait, wait, wait. Maybe you can't know exactly, Commissioner, but you can say no later than, like you just said, 25 by Christmas; no later than -- why is that an unreasonable thing to ask? Chair Sarnoff No, I think you're right. 1 don't think you're wrong. I think -- because -- Commissioner Suarez: I'm not going to be satisfied. Chair Sarnoff -- Danny's going to say, "How am 1 going to know who's going to fill that position that's going to do like" -- Commissioner Suarez: We're going to make reasonable assumptions based on our past -- Chair Sarnoff Yeah, we do. You're right. Commissioner Suarez: -- history. Commissioner Carollo: Hold on, hold on. I'm in agreement that they should have at least 25 additional patrol officers by Christmas. I think it's very doable, because it's not only the officers that are going to be hitting the streets that are already employed by us. At the same time, they're going to be the vacancies, they're going to be working it, and the Chief has mentioned that he plans on filling the 30, 40 positions by the end of the year. So in combination with that, with the ( )lV 0/ A halm Page 76 Printed on 1021 2013 s 0 U v c c 0 u C 12 0 0 0) L r-1 LO N LD 0 c 0 El E a 4, 0) 0 r 0 City Commission Meeting Minutes September 26, 2013 officers that we're looking at for efficiency and being able to put them out on the streets patrolling, / think it should be rather easy to have an additional 25 patrol officers on the street by Christmas. And let me just add, I want to make sure it's additional. In other words, 1 don't want 25 officers to go patrol and then, somehow, 25 officers be taking off to go work some detail or get attached or detached somewhere else or investigative unit. / want -- I think what we're all asking for is additional patrol officers. Mr. Amandi: On the street. Commissioner Carollo: On the streets. So we should have -- at the very least, I think it's very doable. I think it's extremely doable. Chair Sarnojf Schedule our 95, walk them out right now. Chief Orosa: Excuse me? Chair Sarno,: Schedule our 95; dress rehearsal; tell us right now. Chief Orosa: Well, the 25 is doable, like — Chair Sarnoff By Christmas? Chief Orosa: -- the Commissioner says; probably at the end of the year, like I've always said. Chair Sarnoff Okay. Chief Orosa: But keep in mind, this is -- this always is a constant change, because who knows? Commissioner Suarez: But we're going to get there, Chief Chair Same So, all right, 25 by Christmas. Chief Orosa: Okay. Chair Sarnoff That leaves us 70. When will those 70 be hired? Chief Orosa: You're going to -- Chair Sarnoff Ten, you said , were already hired? Chief Orosa: You're going to get five probably next week. Commissioner Carollo: Yeah, but those are included in the 25 by Christmas. 1 think what he's trying to see is -- Chief Orosa: Oh, I thought you meant -- Chair Sarnoff 1 want to give them some -- Chief Orosa: 1 thought you meant the 25 as the new on top of whatever we have now. Vice Chair Gort: No, no. Commissioner Carollo: No, no. City of Miami Page 77 Printed on 10 21 2013 City Commission Meeting Minutes September 26, 2013 Vice Chair Gort: The 95 that we have been discussing -- Chief Orosa.: Yes. Vice Chair Gort: -- how long do you think will be before the 95 will be aboard? And give us a scenario; the 10, 20, 40, 50. Chief Orosa: It means hiring around 60, which that could be probably achieved sometime in March. Chair Sarnoff Okay. Chief Orosa: And it means putting the rest of that -- the other 20 or so as soon as I get the civilians to backfill -- Commissioner Carollo: Right. Chief Orosa: -- which that could be --1 don't know how long it takes to hire civilians. Chair Sarnoff Wait. Right (UNINTELLIGIBLE) just so we're clear, 'cause 1 don't think you said it right, but hey. Twenty-five in December, sixty -- an additional sixty by March -- Chief Orosa: No, no, no. Commissioner Carollo: No, no, no. Chair Sarnoff Sixty total. Chief Orosa: No, no. Listen, out of the 95 -- okay? Chair Sarnoff Okay, here we go. Chief Orosa: Out of the 95, you're going to have 60 that are new hires that will probably be somewhere in March of next year, April. Chair Sarnoff On the street patrolling. Chief Orosa: Hired. Chair Sarnoff On the street patrolling. Chief Orosa: Hired. Mr. Amandi: The 25 from April -- Chief Orosa: On the street -- okay, on she street patrolling -- Mr. Amandi: Commissioner -- Chief Orosa: -- you got the 10 that were recently graduated; you have another 6 that is in orientation; you have the 5 1'm putting out immediately. Chair Sarnoff Good; (UNINTELLIGIBLE) now. Chief Orosa: You have 15 and maybe 5 more if I can get backfilled, so that's the match. City of Miami Page 78 Printed on 10/21/2013 City Commission Meeting Minutes September 26, 2013, Chair Sarnoff Fifteen by December, right, hopefully? Chief Orosa.: Yeah, yeah. Chair Sarnoff And six -- five --15 by December. Chief Orosa: All those that I just mentioned by December, yes. Chair Sarnoff Okay, so that adds up to --16, 21 and 15 is 36. Chief Orosa: Correct. Commissioner Carollo: That's right. That's why I believe that / think 25 is very doable; the minimum of additional patrol officers on the streets -- Chair Sarnoff: Right. Commissioner Carollo: -- in the streets. Chair Sarnoff So 36, and that still leaves you with about 60. 1 know I'm 1 over. Chief Oro. sa: Yes: Chair Sarnoff When would those 60 hit the street? . Chief Orosa: It all depends. Chair Sarnoff Right. Are you going to hire certified officers? Chief Orosa: Well, we -- .Commissioner And that deals with DOJ (Department of Justice) also. Chair Sarnoff But that's what I'm asking Danny. Chief Orosa: But -- Commissioner Suarez: Give usan outside date. Chief Orosa: --let me -- Commissioner Suarez: Give us a deadline. Chief Orosa:-- clarify the point. Commissioner Suarez: Go ahead Chief Orosa: We have to hire everything, certifreds and non-certieds. Commissioner Suarez: Okay. Chief Orosa: I don't know how the list is going to turn out with certifieds or not certifieds. I cannot, you know, tell the future .-- City of Miami ' Page 79 Printed on 10/21/2013 " City Commission . Meeting Minutes September 26, 2013 Chair Sarnoff That's fair. Chief Orosa: -- that out of the thousand, how many are going to be certified and how many are not going to be certified and then who passes the background and who doesn't pass the background. So that's why I'm saying it's difficult to tell you how many are we going to hire that we can put from that list- certified on the road quickly and how many have to go to the academy. Chair Sarnoff And so they understand it, does DOJplay a role in how many certifeds you can hire? Chief Orosa: Yes. DOJ has to give us permission to hire certifteds. Chair Sarno': Explain to them why. Vice Chair Gort: It's important for them to understand the process. Chair Sarno' 'Cause they need to hear it. Chief Orosa: All right, long story short. Back in 1977 somebody complained to the Department ofJustice that the entire City of Miami was discriminatory against Hispanics, entire; not the. Police Department; every single position in the -- from the Parks Department to Sanitation to • everybody. They came in here. They gave us a consent decree, which is an order that we got to do things their way. From that time till now, every single position in the City of Miami has been lifted with approval of the Department ofJustice, except two: police officers and lieutenants. That -- and we have to do it their way. Their way sometimes takes a little bit longer. We would like to be in a position where we say we only want to hire officers that have their certification already, but we can't do that. Now, going back, we have to open it to everybody. You asked me to go to them and ask them for -- allowing us to hire just a list of certified. I did that, and they said "This is the last time.. Don't come back" I haven't been back I'm not going to go back. Now, when we open it up, we open it up to anybody, whether you're certified or not. Anything else? Chair Sarnoff No. 1 think he needs to know, Fernan — Vice Chair Gort: Yeah. Chair Same: -- that crew needs to know why it's taken so long. Mr. Amandi: And Chief 1 say this with all due respect, because you have made some clearly -- some clear steps to address the problem. But let me just give you an example, and 1 say this as a layman to the inner workings of the Police Department. When we had our emergency meeting a little over three weeks ago, you said that we were going to have two full-time officers assigned to the Grove. You followed it up by saying it was three. Chief Orosa: And I even sent you the names. Mr. Amandi: You did. But in my understanding now, it's three additional shifts. It's not three permanent officers, which I asked you several times in that meeting, and you said, "It's going to be permanent, yes; two permanent officers. " You ended up three. But, you see, it's -- that's not even a real representation of what ended up happening. So I understand that they're additional shift That's great. That's a wonderful thing, but it's not the reality of what me, as a resident, can walk away and say "we have three permanent officers at all shifts, seven days a week That's not the reality, which is what you've led us to believe. Chief Orosa: No, no, no, no, no, no, no. City of Miami Page 80 Printed on /0/21/2013 City Commission Meeting Minutes September 26, 2013 Mr. Amandi: So -- and / say this with all due respect, but -- Chief Orosa: I -- Mr. Amandi: 1 feel like in some respects -- I'm not saying you're doing this -- Chief Orosa: Let -- Mr. Amandi: -- but I feel like there's a shell game going on here in some respects. Chief Orosa: -- me clarify, okay? I told you that 1 was going to give you three officers fulltime, and that's what you got. Mr. Amandi: Three permanent officers. Chief Orosa: Three permanent officers full time. If your desire was to get three permanent officers in every shift, then we're talking about 18. 1 don't have 18 to give you. ., L Commissioner Suarez: Nine. o v O Chief Orosa: Eighteen. 4--' v ,° C C Commissioner Carollo: Why? 00 C 4.4 Chief Orosa: Opposite days off v Commissioner Carollo: Days off? to a) Commissioner Suarez: Agreed. Chief Orosa: I don't have 18 to give you. Mr. Amandi: Recognizing that we were already at a deficit for -- we didn't have an officer per zone of the five zones. We had four beforehand. Chief Orosa: Well -- Mr. Amandi: So we still don't even have an officer, full time, permanent, seven days a week for each zone in the Grove. Chief Orosa: You had five; except in the midnight shift, you had four. Mr. Amandi: You mean when my house was broken into at midnight, on Friday, October 24 -- August 24. Chief Orosa: Probably. Mr. Amandi: Right, yeah There you go. So you understand the position that I'm coming at now. Chief Orosa: Mm-hmm. Mr. Amandi: When you play these number games -- and I'm not saying you're playing them, but when / hear them, on the one hand, 1 like to say, "Okay, well, that makes sense." But then we're talking about 95 officers that may not come onto the street until post summer of 2014, which is City of Miami Page x l Printed on 10 2 / 2013 U u City Commission Meeting Minutes September 26, 2013 when, in the last four years, we've seen very clearly is when the crime (UNINTELLIGIBLE) takes place. And this is not just for the Grove; it's for the entire City of Miami. I'm sensitive to it because we're having a property crime situation, but across the board, there are other areas that have this same need. So how do we reconcile that so that -- Vice Chair Gort: Year-round (INAUDIBLE). Mr. Amandi: -- when 1 could report back to the 3,000 people on my e-mail list tomorrow, and they say, "What happened?" I could tell them, "This is clearly what happened"? And there is none of this back and forth confusion, which, frankly, I am suffering through right now. Commissioner Suarez: It's -- I agree. Chair Sarnoff So -- but to move the needle forward, I think we could agree, as a Commission, that this budget gives us the movement we're looking for, this budget. Wait, wait, I'm not done. I -- 'cause 1 don't know how to get any more, because 1 think Carollo would say, and I'd have to agree with him -- you know Carollo and I very rarely agree on anything, but -- Commissioner Suarez: You guys agree on stuff. What is that? Come on. Chair Sarnoff. We -- I tease him. We do. But even if we -- Commissioner Suarez: Stick it on your (UNINTELLIGIBLE), Comish. Commissioner Carollo: You're getting better. Chair Sarnoff I know. Commissioner Carollo: You're seeing my ways. You're getting better. Chair Sarnoff Thanks. Even if we allocated 70 more officers, it almost wouldn't even matter. Commissioner Carollo: And that's why 1 thought we needed to see within our own department for efficiencies, because these would be officers that will be going on patrol rather soon. Chair Sarnoff But here's what we could do. Commissioner Carollo: You understand what I'm saying? Chair Sarnoff ` Right. Commissioner Carollo: These are not going through the hiring process, no. They're already here, they're certified. Mr. Amandi: (UNINTELLIGIBLE) minimum 25 by Christmas -- Commissioner Carollo: Right, right. Mr. Amandi: -- Which is encouraging to hear. Commissioner Carollo: Right. Mr. Amandi: But when you talk about 95 extra officers on the streets, okay, well, that -- Chair Sarnoff But here's -- City of Miami Page 82 Printed on 10 21 '2013 item DI.1 on City Commission Meeting Minutes September 26, 2013 Mr. Amandi: -- by the end of next year. Commissioner Suarez: Exactly. Chair Sarnoff -- what 1 think is encouraging. You know, the needle starts to move, and we know that we could do this, and I think it's important to some of the Commissioners, without de -allocating other departments. So let's just use a place holder for a moment. Let's just say, all right, net new officers, that's our new budget. Now we have to decide how do we -- let's call it the morale issue. How do we fix the morale issue? And that's where you need to come in. Vice Chair Gort: That's what we talked about. Chair Sarnoff Let's deal with morale. Vice Chair Gort: Yeah. Commissioner Suarez: I put it at -- okay, okay. You said five flat? Chair Sarnoff Well -- Commissioner Carollo: No, it's not five flat, but anyways, okay, let me not speak 3 3 Chair Sarnoff Yeah, it's just an -- a�i p 4, .474 Commissioner Carollo: And I think our acting City Manager/ CFO would like to speak. 49 _ c c 0 Mr. Alfonso: I have severe disagreement with the numbers that thepresident o FOP is g % , presenting. If you agree on the proposal, then two and a half million -- or 2.4 million is +_ allocated in your proposal, so, you know, we can't use an additional two and a half million and £ p get to five because we've already spent that money in the proposal. The issue of lieutenants, 1.2 N v million, you know, there is no 1.2 million for lieutenants. Some of the money that he's alluding to, it's already in the 2.4 discussion that we've been having, the recurring issue. We would have to, if the City wants to take that position, amend the budget, do a ordinance --1 mean, those things take time. Commissioner Suarez: Can I rattle off some numbers and you can tell me if they are accurate or inaccurate? Would that be helpful? Mr. Alfonso: Yes. Commissioner Suarez: Okay. The 3 percent bonus, one-time bonus, is equivalent to $2.1 million for police officers. Mr. Alfonso: Correct. Commissioner Suarez: Okay. The 3 percent raise in this budget, '13/14, which is really one and a half 'cause it's for half a year, is equivalent to $1.2 million; is that correct or incorrect? Mr. Alfonso: It is correct. Commissioner Suarez: Okay, that's 3.3 added together. This is the one I don't know about, but you kind ofjust said it isn't, so I'm a little concerned. Have we or have we not budgeted $1.2 million for lieutenants in this budget? City of Miami Page 83 Printed on 1021 2013 item DI.1 on 06/26/14 City Commission Meeting Minutes September 26, 2013 when I'm saying something. Commissioner Suarez: No, I'm not. Can I just finish my freaking point? Commissioner Spence -Jones: Finish it. Commissioner Suarez: Thank you. Commissioner Spence -Jones: Finish it. Commissioner Suarez: I just want to know what we're voting on. Commissioner Spence -Jones: We just -- he just told you. He just -- Commissioner Suarez: No. u L Commissioner Suarez: -- (UNINTELLIGIBLE) you -- += 3 fl-c Commissioner Suarez: I want clarity. I'm sorry, 1 want clarity. O Commissioner Spence -Jones: Danny, give him clarity, please. c •- -a u Commissioner Suarez: Okay? My apologies for asking for clarity. I want to know the budget a; • C we're voting on is going to provide 95, if we fill all the positions -- -o 0 o Commissioner Carollo: Yes. V)i Commissioner Suarez: -- 95 new officers plus -- Mr. Alfonso: Okay, it's going to provide 35 new officers. It's going to take 20 officers -- Commissioner Suarez: Okay, 55. Mr. Alfonso: --from administrative positions. Those are not new; those are existing. Commissioner Carollo: Right. Mr. Alfonso: From administrative positions reassigned. We're going to have to backfill those with 15 additional positions that are civilians. Commissioner Carollo: Right. Commissioner Suarez: Agree. Mr. Alfonso: And we're counting on the existing vacancies to state the number 95, but those are existing, so I want to be careful and say not 95 new officers, but the aggregate of what exists will be 95 new people, bodies in the street when it's all implemented. Yes. Commissioner Suarez: I agree 100 percent with that. Mr. Alfonso: Thank you. Commissioner Suarez: So we're clear on the one part. On the second part is the money that think is necessary and / think a majority of the Commissioners believe is necessary to boost the morale in the Police Department. We have stated that number should be $5 million, okay? So City of Miami Page 100 Printed on 10/21/2013 lD ✓ 0 o u 0 E a) City Commission Meeting Minutes September 26, 2013 the 2 million that we're budgeting additionally will take into account what you've already discovered, that you've already kind of put in your proposals, plus whatever you bargain for, possibly even from this budget year that could constitute the $5 million, correct? Mr. Alfonso: Correct. Commissioner Suarez: That's it. That's all I wanted. I just wanted some clarity on that. I'm sorry if that was -- Chair Sarnoff No, you're right. And just so it's clear, if you don't think you can arrive at an agreement that hasn't been sort of broached here, then walk away, because if somebody didn't come here in good faith, walk away. Commissioner Carollo: And we could always do a mid -year adjustment. Mr. Alfonso: Exactly. Commissioner Suarez: Absolutely. You're absolutely right. Commissioner Carollo: We canalways do a mid year adjust. Commissioner Suarez: Absolutely. Commissioner Carollo: And by the way, in the mid -year adjustment, we will also see where we are with the new hires. Chair Sarnoff Right. Commissioner Carollo: So the possibility of -- Chair Sarnoff Maybe we can even go more. Commissioner Carollo: Maybe (UNINTELLIGIBLE) go more, yes, and that's where I was going. Chair Sarnoff No, you're right. Commissioner Carollo: But the truth of the matter is mid -year, we will see exactly where we are, we'll see what was stated on the record. And, you know, I think the Chief did a very good job, because, listen, I know all of us want the additional officers on the street, but the Chief I believe, was very good at being fair in saying, "Hey, listen, some of this, 1 don't what 1 could promise and 1 don't want to promise because 1 know if I promise, you're going to grill me up here and say, 'Why didn't you do this?"' But 1 think he gave a reasonable amount of 25, at least 25 on patrol by Christmas, and 1 think -- Chair Sarnoff At a very important time of year. Commissioner Carollo: Yes. And 1 think it's very doable, because most of them or a lot of them will come from already our own Police Department. We're just being more efficient, and instead of being behind the desk, they're going to go out into the streets and patrol. So that's where I -- I feel very assured that we'll reach that number. And then mid -year, after January, we will see where we are, and I'm sure we're going to have a lot of this discussion again, and see, Chief okay, how's the hiring? Where are you with the hiring? How many have you hired? We'll ask, "Has any officers left?" And we'll take it from there. Vice Chair Gort: We've been doing that. City of Miami Page IN Printed on 10 212013 r▪ -1 LO N 4.O 0 0 N 0