HomeMy WebLinkAboutCC 1987-09-01 Minutesvd
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Ut"M by mt= MEMO tp To
CITY COMISHOR `op HUM, MAMA
On the let day -or September, 1987 , the City Commission of 14imig
Florida met at the Miami Convention Center, Ordhifi fro C and N 4`00
Southeast Second Avenue, for the purpose of a Departmental gadget Worm htp PIT
The meeting was called to order at 909 aim: by Vita -Mayor J.L. Plummer
Jr, with the following member of the Commission Pound to be present:
Vice -Mayor J•i Li Plummer, Jr,
ALSO PRESENT;
Cesar Odio, City Manager
Lucia Allen Dougherty, City Attorney
Matty Hirai, City Clark
Walter J. Fo6man
Mr. Plummer: As indicated when we call these workshops, this would be not the
norm of a formal presentation, but that of a kind of a free wheeling, ask
questionsand try to get answers kind' of a 'situation, rather than going
through the old traditional dog and pony show and Commissioners could or could
not attend as their schedules met, and as their needs or questions arose.
I'll go ahead,` if it is agreeable with everybody and first and foremost,
something that has been very close to me, I'd like a report, because I don't'
find it in the budget, in reference to pensions and where we are with the
pension' negotiations, or I guess not negotiations, but the Consent Decree in
relation to the Gates Case and ask for where we are at the present time.
Mr. Odio: Well, I did see a budget. They requested yesterday an additional
administrator and in addition to the five positions; they now have, they want
an additional seven positions and my reaction to that is no way. I will ask
the Law Department to look into the Consent Decree and -I read it once Dean and
I read it. I do not believe that we are obligated to do just whatever they
want us to do. There has to be a stop_ somewhere. We have to.
Mr. Plummer: Well, that ,is from an _Administrative side. I_guess my more
concern, because Seven positions are "X" number of dollars and we know what
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that number is. I am more concerned, and have been concerned, with Gates
lawsuits from its beginning.- Based on what is the total contribution that
this year, we the City will make to that fund.
Mr. Odio: Carlos, give us... you have the figure. We have complied with the
Gates Case. In fact, we have put more money in there then then in some points
that we were requested:
Mr. Carlos Garcia: Mr. Vice Mayor, at this time we have a disagreement with
the Pension Trust as far as what kind of interest assumption were to be used
for the City contribution. They have been using 7 percent for the last few
years, They have earned in excess of 20 percent for the last five years.
Last year we asked them to raise that .interest assumption.to eight percent and
they did not agree to that, so at this time we have engaged an arbitrator that
is working between the City and the old system or FICO it is called now, to
resolve that, We expect that resolution to take place before the end of this
month. -
s.
Mr, Plummer; Well, the question is, what do you have in reserve in this
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budget far addressing the contributions?
Mr, Garcia; In this budget' I believe we have close to $30,0000000",
Mr. Flummers Three zero?
Mr, Garcia; Xee, air, which in very.cloee to whet the Gates oettIOMent•calle
for, ,Again, it depend$ on what happened with that arbitratigalp if they rule
SepterAber 1, 1907
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in our favor to the eight percent and vo have surplus monies there. If they
rule In favor of the system, if they use the seven percent fissumption, we may
be short. OKI but again, this City tontribution is related to 'ghat Vill
happen to last 1e9081 and this year's and that will affeet IMIt ysAr's
onntributiont tt is a very oomplioated issue, but the basie differeses is
betwaen the interest assumption they are using, and what the City would like
them to uses That one portent differenea in the interest assumption will
bring about $5,'bbbs'066 in savings to the `pity for every one of those years and
soy as I said, the arbitration has been engaged, the arbitrator, and that
should be resolved by the and of this month,
Mr. Plummer: I aid assuming this matter will come before the City Commission,
If nothing more-, to approve it as part of the budget
Mir. Gareia: That's rights We will do that
Mr. Plummer: And you are targeting the date prior to October 1?
Mr. Garcia: Us have been trying to resolve that for a long time. It is
taking a longer period than we expeeted, but we are hopeful that it will be
resolved before the end of September, yes, sir.
Mr. Plummer: Now, as I recall, we have got a meeting.:* what, a Commission
meeting a week from today?
Mr. Suranas Yes, sir, September 8th'and September 22nd.
Mr. Plummer: I would like at the September 8th meeting that an update, or
that 'level of posture be brought before the Commission so we can have an idea.
When you are talking $30,000,000, you are talking way over 10"percent of
budget.
_Mr. Garcia: We will make you a presentation.
Mr. Plummer: Mr. Manager, the next questions that I have are in the Police
Department. I don't have many. With a little bit of luck, these hearings
ought to be able in three days, mas o menos. Chief, my questions, I'basically
gave one of them to you yesterday, and maybe it is more in the idea of
formatting than it is in anything else, but I notice, as I go through your
budget,I looked, and I am sorry that I can't give you the page number,
because the format we have in front of us is different than the page numbers
of the book. I look over, and I see this objective. "To successfully
investigate all homicides, battery and child abuse cases, while working with
the courts, prosecutors, rape treatment- professionals and .other professional
resources, at 2.9 million dollars." I then turn back, under objectives, or
this is under general: "To take care of traffic, to insure safe and convenient
travel for motorists and pedestrians through enforcement of the traffic laws
and maintain an orderly flow of traffic and pedestrian movement in downtown
and other congested areas," and you are addressing that with $3,500 000. Now,
I don't think anybody would question if we went down the street and asked a
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hundred people what was.more-important, the orderly flow oftraffic, or the
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child abuse and homicides. Yet, we have approximately $500,000 more addressed
to traffic than we do with... I think most people, or most people's mind.,-
Maybe it is in formatting and the way this thing is being presented, but I
think it needs to be explained, and I would ask you to do such:
Chief Dickson;' Thank you, Mr. Plummer. The 3.5 million dollars allocated to
traffic enforcement includes 26'school crossing guards which account for over,
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$500,000 of ,that budget. That is the mandatory, as you know, requirement by
the State and the -County, and also ".the number of child abuse cases and
homicides that occur in the City_ of Miami are in fact are being investigated,
there were some 15 specific child abuse cases that were incidents that
occurred that were all investigated to a satisfactory conclusion during the
past fiscal year, so we are not really behind in any investigations las, it
relates to child 'abuse cases, sexual battery cases,; or homicides.'" However,'.
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the traffic unit also generates some $2,000,000, That would be considered,
which is considered as revenue, which,`for the City budget concern, offset the
cosh for traffic, but the real point, Mr. Plummer, is that; the number of,.
injuries coming out of traffic incidents in this City of Miami largely`
overwhelm the amount of child abuse cages, which we are up on,'by the way, se
well as the number of homicides that occur, We are under a mandate due to a
grant that we just concluded Just about a year ago to also maintain a D4.I,
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2 September 1 R,196•
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ho[plimejnt hf Personal. as well. i Alto have Added �;� �ddit��►,��
Investigators to tits tonal battery vhttrh does the child abuse lttvedtlattitsns
at veil during the J$Ast € 1641 Year, 10 that is it Additional investigators to
do that function
Mr. Plummart Chief, what is the e6st of the school guard t;rossiftgsl the 16
people involved
Thief Dicksoni About $$$S,060, just over halt million dollars.
Mr. Plumart Mr. Manager, what have we tonal We've made a number of entreat
to the School beard that we feel that it is their responsibility, and where
are we, it anywhero, on trying to get them to pickup that tab'?
Mr. Odiot We are not Anywhere. Va are negotiating with them, in fact when
we met Paul Caj as, remember we mentioned that to him.
Mr. Plummart to other words, we have had no response back from thorn?
Mr. Odiot Not yet , that's right:
Mr. Plummer: OK. Chief, not to be funny, ha, ha, but here again, I believe
it is more format than anything. I'm coming ungluedl you speak on one page
here, goals and objectives, output data, that you received 775,000 calls last
year for service, both emergency and non emergency. Chief, that comes out to
about $10.00 a call. Can you explain that, why it is so high? And also, Mr.
Manager, I would follow that up. As you know, t've been an advocate for two
years now and nothing has been done in reference to combining the dispatch and
the complaint rooms of both police and fire.
Mr. Odio: Summing what? We have a complete study done on that and we are
looking at the study now to see if it makes'sense, how we do it.
Mr. Plummer: Well, OK, because, you know, at one projection that.I saw, the
City could save almost $1,000000 and not increase the level of services.
Mr. Odio: That is not an accurate number, Commissioner. The study doesn't
point to the fact that we can save a million dollars. The study is finished.
Right? Isn't a million dollars saved?
Mr. Plummer: Well, if it takes two years to .implement, as it did the study,
it will be more than a million dollars.
Mr. Odio: No, , no, we might not implement, that's what I am saying,it might
not make any sense to do that.
Mr. Plummer: OK, well, at $10.00 per call, based on these numbers, and I am
just using the numbers here. At $10.00 a call, I think it begs out for
something to be done, and Chief, I would ask you, whether it is formatting,
you know, and let me tell you, the Fire Department is worse than you are.
They are $31.00 a call,
Chief Dickson: OK, let me try to quickly elaborate on that. When the cost is
broken down into dollars per call, we are taking into consideration all the
people that participate in that particular call. For instance, we are talking
dispatchers, we are talking police officers that received the call, we are
talking people who make the report, people who enter the reports into our
reporting system, for U.C.R. and F.D.L.E. reports; we are talking people who
maintain the records, we are talking vehicle cost and response, and a lot of
things that would take a lot of elaboration, but it is broken down into
several labor response costs in that $10.00 per response.
Mr, Plummer: Well, I think that we could all agree that the format could be a
little bit different and it wouldn't be as questionable as it is, as I have.it'
In front of me, Chief, I'd like to ask you now, if I may, where are we,,, we
till read with interest about the sting operations, How are they going? Do
you have adequate monies for them?,,. and where do you see this year we are
going with It?
Chief Dickson: Well, the sting operations are so important to us, as it has
been proven, that we intend to continue the sting operations and where
possible, intendify it, who results of the ating operation reflects in our::.,
3 September 1R 1907
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reporting system and Alto in n teiatti to the decreasing tritn in thio8e firsts
where sting npernttnnn have hest conducted, let inetnee; In tib-trty 'pity end
Overt n$ parts of Little Ravana end d ttcn - the dmtbwh areea, All eh6v a
eignittcant reduction in crass becausa these are the places +ohtra the sting
operations verb needad, and shore they were tan -ducted. overall the City has
had ss�mething like an 8.4 Percent reductit�n in violent sertz ua trims. Us
attribute this do a great eattht nit the sting operatlori bet-ause it reflects
directly an those areas that we have ct5ncentratsd on. Wa do intend to
continue, and @van'If posatble, ifltanntty the sttng operations.
Mr. Plumar# give n►a an updating, it you vtil, nn the autwobile situations
Chief Ditknoni. t think when Ron Williams comas up hero, he'll be able to
help; but the car...
Mr, bdioa They are all but, to fact, they have to return stxty, all of
the... they have too manly cars row.
Chief hicksons The cars are all...
Mr. Plummer: Mhos, what?
Mr. Odio: They have too Many cars. They have to return 60 cars that they owe
us back, but they...
Mr. Plummer, Should 1 remind you of a Commission meeting about six months
ago?
Mr. Odio: Sure, please do, 1 don't remember.
Mr. Plummer: You don't remember when I told you 203 cars were too many?
Mr. Odio: Too many?
Mr. Plummer: Yes, and you are telling me now you have got to return 60?
Mr. Odio: No, no, I am saying of the old cars. We put all the new fleet out,
so but...
Mr. Plummer: Ok.
Chief Dickson: Yes, those are the old cars that we have to give up and get
rid of, but we have... our fleet is up to date. Our objective and our goal
was to achieve a fleet of no less than two year old cars: 185, 186, 187.'
Mr. Plummer: Has the program of take home cars been implemented?
Chief Dickson: That is scheduled to be implemented Tuesday, I believe,
Commissioner.
Mr. Plummer: Today, or a week from today?
Chief Dickson: A week from today.
Mr. Plummer: And how many cars are going to be involved with that?
Mr. Odio: ... (INAUDIBLE)... 35 cars.
Chief Dicksons Yes, 35 cars were on for the take home program.
Mr. Plummer; Have the 35 officers already been chosen?
Chief Dickson; They have been identified,
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Mr, Plummexs And they all live in the City of Miami.
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Chief Dickson; Every one of them lives in.the City of Miami.
Mr. Plwmars, Live in the City of Miami?
Chief Dickagn: Yea,
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69ptembes l,. 1967
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Mrs OdW i thio that program is toing to work.
Mr. Plutmeat=. 61i, .1 think it is 1961ng to be a, � - theta to no 4"Stion its iv
rind that it will Vor ,
ter. Mai I hope we tan expand that in the futures t really d64
Chief Pickaon: Willis it is ,a pilot program and we believe it is going to be
sueceeaful in extending the life of the cars. they will be taken bate of a
lot better and we believe that the life of these ears can be extended and the
officers in facts will not 'want to give them up, when the tuna coines
Mr, Plummer, Chief, a final question. Conversation on the street is, your
budget in cut by approximately $3,000,000.
Mr. Odios No, it was not cut. It is the same amount of dollars that they had
this year.
Mr. Plummer, From 74 to 71 million?
Mr. Odio: Yes, well, but they saved...
Mr. Plummer, Is that not $3,000,000?
Mr. Odios No, but they saved this year three, so the net is the same.
Mr. Plummers Chief, your budget has been cut by approximately $3,000,000.
The Manager says that under no circumstances, for which I congratulate him of
coming in with a budget below what was last year and I want to tell you for
oncein my 17 years, it is nice to hear people call and say, "My taxes went
down!" The Manager says under no circumstances will the, level of service be
dropped, but in most cases, it will be increased. Would you please 'speak to
the fact that your budget is down, but you are going to give' better service
and explain to me how you are going to do it?
Chief Dickson: Well...
Mr. Odio: If I ask him to up it I'm sure he'll say yes.
Mr. Plummer: You've got to have a telephone booth.
Chief Dickson: This is not an easy task, Commissioner Plummer. We have been
preparing for something like this now for the last two years, at least. We
have gone, through a civilianization program with putting more police officers
on the street. We have bought in police aides to compensate for the number of
civilians that we in fact were not able to replace on`a permanent basis. We
have reorganized the department to be more operationally responsive. We have
worked over the last year or so with actually less' people than we had been
accustomed to in the past. We have developed programs to respond to the -
reduction in our .budget. There is no way to achieve the reduction in our
budget of course, because it is such a huge spice out of the police budget,
without the risk of also losing civilian personnel.
Mr. Plummer: Yet, you increased it.
J Chief Dickson: No, we are not increasing personnel in relation to.... Sworn
we are, civilian, we are not. We have several things planned to respond to
this cut in budget. One of them is the increase in the number of reserve
people that have been greatly neglected over the years, the reserve program,
and all that can be done has not been done with the reserve program. The. goal
is to achieve 100 reserve people, which we can do. Also, there is another
area that we have not, as a department responded to as well as we should or
could over the previous years, and that is the civilian volunteer program that
we also will begin to do a lot more recruiting in that effort. I understand
the Fire Department does very well in their civilian recruitment, Also# we
have used our ability to achieve grants in the City of Miami which have,been
very successful at accomplishing. We have put some 19 with a. projected' goal
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of over 20 people in all of our major senior citizen sitea at no coat to the
City, but through a grant and a forfeiture funds. These are trained senior
cittgon guards# trained by the Miami Police Department, certified to take up
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the slack for what would be police' officers having to policy those senior
citizens: centers. Those guards are already on the sites. They have been
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September 1 # 1967
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there now for s f1w Months, and in fact, Vherg there Wag a show of fear of
crime and trims itself actually, on and around those sites, it h;as virtually
declined to almost Eero at this time. We have been able to free up btfitfirs
It tjitse areas, again, at no cost to the 'City,, yhesg hind of programs,
without a lot of elaboration, are the kinds of innovative thitigs that the
Mamii police Department will have to do to faintain the level of service- t
would tat venture to say that the level of service is going to exceed that of
the past4 but what we are striving for is to maintain the level of tervios
which ties boon excellent over the past fiscal year. If we do thati that we
certainly will be achieving our goal of maintaining the level of service that
we have provided over the past fiscal year.
Mr4 plummier: What have you done, if anything, in implementing the garage
downtown that the City has been paying $1,00,000 worth of subsidy? y.. at the
last, or two Commission meetings ago, about turning that unused space into an
auto pounds Has that been implemented?
Mr. Odiot Commissioner, I really hate to say this, but I have to congratulate
you on that idea, because I am finding out now as I came back from vacation,
that it is a great idea. We are going to bring it to the Commission for
aetion. I believe... Wally; is it going to be in the second meeting?... the
first meting in October, since we are only going to one meeting on regular
items. We could have brought it in the second meeting. We will bring it to
the October meeting and we can make a lot of money for the police Department
in that parking garage. Mike, do you have any...
Chief Dickson: We have had four meetings with Roger Carlton and his group
since that time, Commissioner, which is an excellent idea. We have no
hesitation on assuming that responsibility. It could be an asset to us. I
would just like to make a recommendation that we be able to do our own towing
as well, because..:
Mr. Odio: We can make more money.
Mr. Plummer: It's worth looking into. The City of Dallas and the City of New
Orleans both do their own towing as far as that and someone told me, I think,
somewhere along the line, the City of Dallas went out in the country and
bought 80 acres and they made about $2,000,000 on a yearly basis.
Mr. Odio: I believe from many indications that we could very well eat up that
deficit at that garage._
Mr. Plummer: Well, Mr. Manager, as you know my greatest concern, that we have
been ,paying $1,500,000 a yearinsubsidy on the thing and you know, either
sell it, get rid of it, or find an answer to where we are not going to
continue to put subsidy.
Mr. Odio: Well, because of that idea, I believe that you will see it and once
we bring it to you, and we have to bring it in the first meeting of October so
we can implement it this year, you will see that deficit go away.
Mr. Plummer: Mr. Manager, I guess this question is to you, but Chief, do you
want to respond, and Chief Duke. The Commission charged_ me with the
responsibility of trying to meeting with the media as it relates to the
problems where they are being able to monitor the radios. We have put a
system in as a trial basis which seems to be working. We have not had any
complaints, by the way, but Mr. Manager, as you know, and I brought to your
attention, it is going to require at least one or two more people in either
police or fire. Now, I'd hate to come before the City Commission and say that
we have a system and we found a solution and it is working, and have you tell
me that we don't have the money to implement the system, because I'm going to
get real upset about that. Now, has provision been made in this budget - I
forewarned you a couple of months ago. All right, you are aware of what the
system is and it seems to be.. I don't know if Cory is here, or Cristy
Hickman are here. Hither one of them here? puke, can you speak... as for as
I know,'we are yet to have a complaint that the system is not a workable
system, and I thins, if in fact, it is a good solutionp I don't think it is
going to coat a hell of a dot of money to implemient,, joining with hands with
the d,I.O. Chief Puke, you...
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Chief Colonel Duke. At the prevent time, what we are doing, we are utilizing
as we dlocu000d in your office the oyotom►, where we announce over through our
September 1; 1907
department, 4"er thaftn,al l8 Vhet1 Vas have gat s thing of a node -me stature -or
greater th the Fire llapartsment. At this point we have not rottived any
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templaint from the 1mtdia1 but l think the smedti to tttll waiting for us to
tame hack wtth the total solution. 'fig have taken one other step in the fire
Department ire we have nnma line with the system where we tAn put cut the
intarmattnn, when your people tag back to again, we are Tieing to handle
that through our e6 mmuntcatitm diwiatan at this particular time.
Mr. Plummer: Well, it aiat the Police Department who t think wanted §even
additional personnel, which ve told them basically they were10t going to get,
and I i gent to make ours, I don't want to go and have egg on my tics
.dust...
In front of the eommitston, and oayi *HL%y, we found a solution and it it
working because we tatted 1W and then not have the adequate funds to back
it up, sty I would ask, since we have got everybody scratching their head over
there that by September the 8th, I want that 4ueati6n resolved.,,
Mr, Larry B6amltrt (OFF MIRE) We will have somebody at P.I.O. now on the
list and
Mr, Plummar,. Oft, P, t, d, , now, remember the problem. The problem is is after
StOO o'clock at night, they go home
Mr. Poemler: (OP'P MIKE) 24 hours.
Mr. Plummert Exactly.
Mr. Boemler: Right now we are open, at least P,I.O. on two shifts and we open
six days a weekand we are going to have to expand that to all three shifts,
seven days 'a week.
Mr. Plummer: Well, I leave it to your discretion how you do it, but Larry, I
think you are well aware that this system is working. It seems to be very
much aware, we outlined, the fifteen points of 'what the press wants- to be
notified on and it seems to be working, so I just want to... all I am saying
is..
Mr.'Boemler: (OFF MIKE, INAUDIBLE)
Mr. Plummer: ... these are budget hearings, these are dollars. It is going
to take some dollars, so let's make sure that they are there when we go ahead
before the Commission. I'm assuming the Commission will pass this solution,
OK? That is all I am asking. Duke, don't go. Chief Dickson, you can sit
down, as far as I am concerned.
Mr. Odio: Mr. Plummer.
Mr. Plummer: Yes.
Mr. Odio: The Mayor asked if any questions from the Fire Department could
wait until he gets here, but if not, we will just repeat it after, I don't
care.
Mr. Plummer: Well, I have two questions of Chief Duke, and basically they are
questions I've asked before of the Fire. Chief Duke, first one is, your phone
calls into your department are equating out to $31.00 a phone call, and I
don't mean to pick on something so insignificant, but I think it is a'damn big
' item in the budget. It is a lot of money.
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Chief Duke: OK, the Communications Division of the Fire Department costs us
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approximately 17 million dollars. That's 21 operators, the supervisory
personnel. On top of that, plus a small cadre uniformed personnel, That
particular operation not only handles the alarm calls coming in, but it also
handles the centrex for the entire city, where we have got someone who has got
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to monitor that around the clock, It also handles all of the computer aspects
of the Department of Fire, so it is not just the receiving of the alarms in
that particular area, sir.Ati
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Mr, Qdic: Commissioner, what 1'd like to do when the report in finished, I'll
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look at it and maybe we can have a tweeting with police and fire and go over
that report, Commissioner, and see if it makes sense to do something,
7 September 1, 1907
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Mrt Humeri fir. 14AAAggf, let ibe tell you soughing, t Alt, nOt going to give
up Until seft-bb-ody proves 'die wrong, all fight
M r r U161 That is why 1 VAnt n a a i t
Mr. Plummom N6Vj O11 is isperAting3 with About VhAt Is it Pranki About f,
,eoPlu, Out of the DAde COdfityl ife are operating with 1% U1 1iow4 t1m not
going to stand,..* and let The tail you this, so you'd better n►ske aura that YOU
taffis with the right numbers . , I are► not going to stand Atilt for ssmebody
telling ina that Motorola is going to charge us MR," dollars, because when
MotordlA tells Ma, you hit theta broadside And said, 'Mika nia u ballpark figure
with a little hit of comfort built It," tam not =going to Accept that figure.
1 want definite: biddable figures of what it is going to cost and 1 think you
are going to find out that there is a big difference batween ghat is ballpark
figure, and that of what actual costs .are, Ott?
Mr. Odiot Good, if we can save that money.
Captain Duka: Commissioner Plummer, further to clarify one of the points that
when you are discussing the actual cuts per alarm, in our 'situation, we are
dealing with groups of vehicles at one particular time, and if you look At All
of the vehicles that have responded individually, that would take some kindof
communications value, if you would, with the dispatchers, is in excess of
77,000 runs, plus all of the other communications that would take place
between those two operations under normal business day operations, drills,
going to school, transferring the apparatus around, etc., so if you look at
individual calls in that form, it would be quite a large difference, yes, sir.
Mr. Plummer: Chief, it is a large number: Half of the cities in the State of
Florida are under 3,000 people. Half of the cities in the State of Florida
don't have a budget in the amount that you have for phone calls, OK?- Now,
come back to the same question of you than I had of the Chief, ,and that
question is, your budget is down by approximately $2,000,000. The Manager
assures us that there will be no level in the drop in the level of services..
How do you address that problem?
Chief Duke: The Manager has assured me that_I will have more control over the
Fire' Department's budget than has been done in the past, , and if that is the
case, I think that we will be able to maintain the same level of service
throughout the year with manipulation of the work force to accommodate all
those needs of the citizens of Miami.
Mr. Plummer: That's fine. That's a broad brush. Now give me some details.
Give me, for instance.
Chief Dukes Well, for instance, we plan to look at the level of service that
we are delivering and the different way that we might be able to do that. We
need to address some concerns that have come up over the few years, such as
hazardous. materials. We 'plan to do some things with the hazardous materials
program in the City of Miami, without reducing...
Mr. Plummer: You are speaking of cutting budget, not increasing,
Chief Duke: Yes, sir.
Mr. Plummer: Now, how do you intend to make up for approximately a two
i, million dollar downfall in your budget?
Mr.'Surana: He is going up, sir, 1.1 million,
Chief puke: sty budget is an increase of 3.4 percent,
Mr. Suranas 1,1 million higher,
Mr. Plummer; The problems are exactly different, then.
$4
Mr, Od,io; I'll be glad to cut then, but...
Mr. Plwnmer; I stand corrected, Chief. OK, go ahead, And the others gp the,
�a
t
other way arouad
Sspt�tah+�r 1,907-
thief buko, tty Budget is a retueties at ghat I had requested by about
epprul"Ately 41,osiloot alid in that veins the Manager has assured "s that you
Matey, with tae halving antral of the budget through our budget presoess, that I
Vill be able t$ 166MPlish these things that basinally the Commission has
undated At this point.
Mrs Odin: They are authorized to add IS firefighters to keep the level of
firefighters at the same level that they have new, so they will hiring lS, I
believe, this year.
Chief buke: The discussion we had was to keep the work force somewhere near
that average, yen sir, throughout the department.
Mr. plummier: Chief, one of the things that we spoke to every year is the
amount of unnecessary rescue runs. We were told at one time that almost ab
percent of the runs were unnecessary, and your predecessor spoke about an Iowa
Plan, as I recall, about doing something to address getting more information
and reduce that number. What I an looking at here doesn't looks or doesn't
appear to me, to be a reduction in the number of calls for rescue$ so I would
ask you, have you implemented this Iowa plan? Is there anything to it, and
what is being clone about it?
Chief Duke: OX, I am not sure what the Iowa plan is; sir, but we have
implemented a program where our operators do an in depth screening of the runs
as they come in, taking in, you know, in consideration the timeliness of the
dispatch, and those calls that do not require the assistance of the fire
Department, either through a B.L.S. response (basic life supports and
response) or an advance life support response, we automatically transfer that
call over to the private ambulances in the area, and they roll on those
responses instead of us, and that's somewhere around 3,000 calls that we will
not respond to this year, by utilizing that format. The growth that we have
experienced in the City of Miami in the population, the aging of the State of
Florida, has prompted the increase in the amount of rescue runs and I am sure
that we will continue to grow at somewhere between three and fivepercent' for
many years to come, sir.
Mr. Plummer: Chief, we instigated two programs last year in the Fire
Department. One was similar as we had in the Police Department, as false
alarms. There was a charge made for it. That is instigated, is that correct?
Chief Duke: That is correct, sir.
Mr. Plummer: All right. Under no circumstances was that ever to be a revenue
producer. What it was to was hopefully make people have good equipment so it
would cut down the number of false alarms. How is that working?
Chief Duke: The indications that we had, it is very difficult to determine,
you know, whether we have had a tremendous reduction in the false alarms, but
it has reduced the number of alarms that have come into the...
Mr. Plummer: Chief, it ought to be easy.
Chief Duke: Well...
Mr. Plummer: Your predecessor told us that at Mercy Hospital, Jackson
Hospital' and Veteran's Hospital, in a six month's period, they had 123 false
alarms, so it ought to be easy to monitor.
Chief: Well, the situation is that as these companies redo their alarm
systems, these buildings redo their alarm systems, it generates a certain
number of alarms in that process. The indication Is that we have had a
reduction in false alarms of that nature that would fall into that category
u
and in fact, that program has generated somewhere around $6,000, as I
remember,.
r,
Mr. Plummer; Not even interested in the revenue, OK?
Chief NO: It has had the function of individuals working on there sys3tems$
maintaining them, and keeping them up to a degree that is a responsible
situation for those Individusl.n:
'r
9 Soptember I, 1907
''�
� l ► ft The brier thin1 that ve hapl+mented last Isar and esusod a let
of people who didn't us. derataetd alarms, to the 'Volleotioit for, as Wig VOUd
tall, mbulanes runs. line It that program going, &Ad what can You tell At
about that
-Chief Dukes Oki we instituted the program where we +charged for our rescue
whenever they traetapart someone that we have broken the body, as far as an
or whatever, We take charge of that individual. then use transport, and
as you knows we charge 'a fee for than the and the Manager have
,tot directed file to really pursue increasing the service fee that we charge for
this At this particular tithe, t guess it has generated somewhere around
$1d0,000 between the two different companies that we have used. To that
degreei it has been sotaewhat successful, The direction that t am gettingfrom
,City government is to not pursue those people that really -can't afford to pay
those fees, and that's where we are at, sir.
Mr. Plummort OR, has any 'case been taken to court?
Chief Dukaa ` Not that I am aware oft sit.
Mr. Plumt:ert And no one has been dunned, or created any hardship?
Chief Duket Not other than the normal process would take through the contract
that we have with these two different individual companies.
Mr. Plummer: And basically I guess than what we are saying is, that what we
intended was to come from insurances medicare and other agencies who would
normally pay.
Chief Duket That's exactly where we are at, sir.
Mr. Plummer: I have no further questions of you, Chief. Mr. Manager, I
really don't have anything else. You know... let me make sure, we are going
to have budget hearings for the public on the 8th?
Mr. Odio: On the Commission meeting of the 8th and the 22nd.
Mr. Plummer: Yes, right. Now, are you going to go through'a scenario at that
time of any kind?
Mr. Odio: No, sir, I was not planning to, unless you want me to, but we were
not planning to do anything except listen to the public and...
Mr. Plummer: Well, of course, you know, I want to ask the other areas and I
respect the Mayor. He is going to be here at 10:00 a.m. I basically want to
ask the other question of Parks, and the only question I have there is, your
budget,' what do you see for this coming year, and how is it going to be
addressed?
Mr. Odio: Could we... well, do you want...
Mr. Plummer: Well, he said he would be at 10:00 o'clock, why don't we wait
for him just those few minutes and see if he is in fact... Let me, if may,
call on ,public facilities'. My basic question in public facilities, we read
with the lights that the golf courses are doing well and I guess basically the
real question I have is in reference to the Orange Howl and how it is doing
sla
and where we are going with that.
Mr, Odio: I went by there yesterday. Commissioner, I don't know if you have
been in the new press box, That is a beautiful thing to see. I hope
eventually by the next year, we can do the same, renovate the other two
floors.'' It is a first class press box. It is finished, except for the
bathroom and it is a first class facility and we are going to keep renovating
the seating arrangements and the bathrooms and so forth every year, We nave a
plan for that, Waiter, do you want,,,?
Mr, Walter Golby; For this particular year, the Orange Howl actually showed a
profit of an excess of $400,000,
Mr. Plummer: What woo projected?
10 Ppptomber 1, 1907
mr. pottli our projattee profit avian Ar-ound $1040, lbactuts we antusily bald
the lialphins in tiers far part tf tip fisest Yearn gifiannna Vithout the
boi�tphiti to our upeomin budget, we still indtafits that v8% vIll fak- At t'd
�e
a�til�,��lf1 profitd
Mr. 'hers Profit, and that is twoftd Upa�n 691
Mr. aoibyt That's right.
Mr. plumars 2eydnd sspa sae?
Mr. Oolbyi- 'ihat's 'beyond expenses and that is primarily due to the extra
events, the coneerts and this type of thing that we have been able to bring
in at a peak time when Mr. Robbie isn't able to 46 it in his facility -
Mr. Odiog I was asking Colby last week, I read something in the papers
whether We are going to be hurt competitively on conearts by the new stadium.
This year we're not. We have two concerts signed up already. Two of them
will be sell outs. Maybe thosetwo will be a @all out, so we will make a
large profit from that. My eonearn is whether we will be hurt in the future,
so I think we should look at the idea that you have a permanent stage, so that
we can have those additional things to give to the promoters that will make us
more competitive.
Mr. Plummert Give me an update, if you will, on the renovations of Dinner key
Auditorium.
- Mr. Golby: Well, right now, the renovations are still in the planning stage.
1 know that they have been submitted to the particular board that is
controlling the money, but that is as far as we have gone as far as the design
stage and they are to make a report- to the City Commission some time very
shortly.
Mr. Plummer: May I ask you if there is any truth to a rumor that I heard that
the architect's plans came in at about $15,000,000?
Mr. Golby: The overall plan that he brought in came in at $15,000,000, but it
actually included two or three additions to the auditorium,' which was not
called for.
Mr. Odio: It is on the agenda of the September 8th meeting, anyway,
Commissioner.
Mr. Plummer: Mr. Manager, the Commission was explicit that that was not to
-exceed ''$5,000,0001'
Mr. Odio: That's the way it is going to bel
Mr. Plummer: Wait a minute now, wait a minute! Architects don't work for
their health, they work for money. And when they do a $15,000,000, they get a
hell of a lot more money then if they were doing a $5,000,000 project. Who
gave them the latitude, or the lack of instructions to come in at fifteen
rather than at five)
Mr. Odio: I don't know where they got their latitude, because they were
clearly told up front that we only had $5,000,000.
Mr. Plummer: Right. I don't know who the architect is, and I don't want to
know. I don't want to know, OK? But, let me tell you something, that is one
of the failings _we've had in this City, is the fact that we get these
grandiose plans that we know in advance that we can't and `people tell me they
get tired of hearing me harp on the fact that -it is "X" "X""X" Now, let me
tell you something, Somewhere along the line, ,there was a miscommunication,;
that if this City Commission said to you, $5,000,000 max, and the plan came in
at $l5,000,000.
jf
Mr. Odio; Well# np, the preliminary plans will be presented to you September
$th for $5,000 000 and that $a it. We need to move fact on this -because we
have to have that facility_ready for the 1$9 AST! convention.
Mr. Plummer: But, you nee, let me tell you what it la' gong to do. The
Problemwe ale oi`nS to have as a Commieeien, to we are 'going `to b plagued
now, why didn't we do these other super thing@ for that auditorlun►.
1.
1i September 1, 1907
F
x�
� _' _ 3 �.r1 `t _ r4.n : £..{ .'�,. ,i:�t';,x�F %vS Ai'h"k+'r.,.Jhf.'S Cif•
10. '0dlbi That design is t6t 1VAR-6.4 it is A dead iasue, neb6dy, �.
Mr. Plumer3 l just don't understand why, wheA we SAY 030600 AAd roe Bean
$g,001061 that somebody comes back with A $04DO400 plan. NOV4 you Geri
see the arniAg after headlines,., '"Coatissien cuts project by $l01,060 '0604 or
'..
two=thirds.
:
Mr. John Cilchriat C-6mmiAsi nor4 I think that IS A little bit misunderstood
to call that A $15,060,000 project. WhAt we did was to explore alternative
ways to approach it. if you back off and count up those alternatives, you get
to fifteen, but there was never any intention of doing that. We explored on
the instruction of major meetings and Manner consultants, the possibility of
putting meeting rooms in as opposed toexpanding the expanding the space$ as
an 6mamplej and to loom at the kitchen As Alternative ways, in addition to
J.p.'s kitchen, which now servos it, What happensif you put a full blown
kitchen in, and so forth. It was never...
Mr. Blummert Did J.F.'s reopen?
Mr. G lchristt Not yet, not at this point. They have a commitment to put
$750,000 into renovations, under their lease agreement. They are looking at
that, but it was not a $15,000,000 project, that's a misunderstanding. We are
coming to the Commission on the Oth with this $5,000,000 project. We simply
explored all those' possibilities in avery short period of time. If you add
those up and I know that the subcommittee to the Sports Authority which
oversees that, which is Monty Trainer, and Funkey Boyers and Skip Sheppard
were concerned because they added them up, but that is not what was intended.
We simply explored what better ways to solve the problem was and we are coming
to the Commission with a $5,000,000 proposed budget.
Mr. Plummer: Address where we are here with the exhibition space here in this
facility.
Mr. Odio: As you can see if you go by there, it could be ready for December.
We have a problem right now with the flower show.- They are demanding more
money than the owner here is willing to pay. I have asked the City Attorney
to look into the possibility of the City moving in and take them by legal
means, because they are going to hold up the work if we don't get them out
fast, but the rest of the room is all cleaned out.
Mr. Plummer: I'm reminding you of my convention here in October.
Mr. Odio: It will not be interfered with.
Mr. Plummer: Don't let me be embarrassed.
Mr. Odio: No, I talked to the general' manager of the Hyatt Hotel. That area
is very clean right now anyway. It will not be interfered with.
Mr. Plummer: Golby, you got anything you want to tell us?
Mr. Golby: I just want to say that one of the happy things is that the Marine
Stadium is turning a profit of $90,000 this year and we hope to project that
on the next year.
Mr. Plummer: That is from a deficit of over two hundred?
I
Mr. Golby: That is right.
Mr. Odio: When we first took over, it was $300,000 deficit in that Marine
Stadium about eight years ago, if I remember, steady, -°that 'deficit,
;r:
"
Mr. Golby: And hopefully the construction of Coconut Grovexhlbition Oenter,
M1�
right now we are approaching very close to a $10,000 profit. Again from it
facility that has boon losing money in the past. The only thing we are hoping
is that we are .able to work around the construction and maintain those
busi.nespes that we have been able to book and` we have been all nappy since
construction:
Mr, -Plummer: Mr. Manager,,just as a aidelighb, i now on T,V, last niSht:that
,
bath Mr. Jankovich and Jones are "poaa bly,going to be leaving the untvernity,'
r
j
12 September 1, 1907
—_ _- - , -
1
Mr4 06161 hit design is fiat even... it is a dead issue, nob-ody. K 4
Mr. gluier: # Just don't wadorstand why, when we say 046004,040 and we ih*ail
4a100010001 that somebody cranes hack with a W4000,000 plan. Vovi you can
too the morning after hoadlitess. s0ommission cuts project by or
two-thirds.
ter. John Gil'christt Commissioner, l think that is a little 'bit misunderstood
to call that a $15,0001000.project. What we did was to explore alternative
ways to approach its If you back off and count up those alternatives, you get
to fifteen, but there was never any intention of doing that. We explored on
the instruction of major meetings and planner consultants, the possibility of
putting meeting roomo in as opposed to expanding the expanding the space, as
an examplei and to look at the kitchen an alternative ways, in addition to
J.P.is kitchen, which now serves it. What happens if you put a full blown
kitchen in, and so forth. it was never...
Mrs glummer: Did J.Pis reopen?
Mr. Gilchrist: Not yet, not at this point. They have a commitment to put
$730,000 into renovations, under their lease agreement. They are looking at
that, but it was not a $15,000,000 project, that's a misunderstanding. We are
coming to the Commission on the 8th with this $50000,000 project. We simply
explored all those possibilities in a very short period of time. If you add
those up and I know that the subcommittee to the Sports Authority which
oversees that, which is Monty Trainer, and Funkey Beyers and Skip Sheppard
were concerned because they added them up, but that is not what was intended.
We simply explored what better ways to solve the problem was and we are coming
to the Commission with a $5,000,000 proposed budget.
Mr. Plummer: Address where we are here with the exhibition space here in this
facility.
Mr. Odio: As you can see if you go by there, it could be ready for December.
We have a problem right now with the flower show. They are demanding' more
-
money than the owner here is willing to pay. I have asked the City Attorney
to look_ into the possibility of the City; moving in and take them by legal
-i
means, because they are going to hold up the work if we don't get them out
fast,, but the rest of the room is all cleaned out.
Mr. Plummer: I'm reminding you of my convention here in October.
Mr. Odio: It will not be interfered with.
Mr. Plummer: Don't let me be embarrassed.
Mr. Odio: No, I talked to the general manager of the Hyatt Hotel. That area
is very clean right now anyway. It will not be interfered with.
Mr. Plummer:; Golby, you got anything you want to tell us?
Mr. Golby: I just want to say that one of the happy things is that the Marine
Stadium is turning a' profit of $90,000 this year and we hope to project that
on the next year.
' Mr. Plummer: That is from a`deficit of over two hundred?
Mr. Golby: That is right.
Mr, Odio: When we first took over, it was $300,000 deficit in that Marine'
'
Stadium about eight years ago, if I remember, steady, that deficit,
Mr, Golby: And hopefully the construction of Coconut Grove Exhibition Center,
r Ak
y ,_ profit again from a
right now we are approaching ver clogs to a $10 000
facility that has been loving money in the past, The only thing we are hoping
in that we are able to work around the construction and 'maintain those
businesses that we have been able to book end we have been all happlsince-
construction,
Mr, Plummer:, Mr, Monager+ just so a sidelight# .1 oaw cn,T,V, iaat Aipht.thst
both Mr, Jankovich and Jones Are possibly going to be leaving the university,
�
12 $@ptsmber 1, 1907
i
,.:. ,: ,,; - i d � 7j t .t 3 5'irsn. �6�;';r`'• 51F � t
I thtak that is dovAttattttt. t thta-k this tttosta t not -as to '15 and tell
thorn that vo Vant them to Stay, ,guess roatly, t shouldn't say
aapett,S1111 but Saul Janitovich his boas vorV4 very strong alliance tat years
wtth this City slid I Vant to toll you t Vauld hate to Sao that tnan I'mej t
rsally mftlt. tie has .dust been a drtvitlg force with this City. Valtor, l
have tiot'hta% also Vtth ,YOU, Hr, 11attagor4 lilt you watct to taste a five minute
brsat, and hopstully then the t4jyer wilt be horo:
"T =tZV 'THO§t VIMS fT FOR TM SUDUT VDRK9MOF
1VTO A gAtF�`IMCESS AT A.M. AND C0VV=*D AT
lot02 A.M, I WITH VtCa MAYOR J. L. FLEA OF Tn UTF
COMMISHON rom TO is t"1§RNT4
Mr. Flummert Mr. Manager, the seat tquestion I have is of you. Mr. Manager
sty office has received a number of phone calls about an article which appeared
in the pAper, in which you are giving depArtment "heads i.e, a cash bonus for
saving money. The question arises, that it in fact, that is the case, without
the general public having the opportunity to argue the -case', that it in almost
a Jesse .lames random holdup and why, if these people are making (and i am
laying the numbers right on the table; an a phone calls came into ale) these
people are raking $70,000 a year as a director, why a cash bonus has to be
.Al +t th doin it ae art of their regular salary? You might as
given, y area ey g p
well address it now, because it is going to come up later, I can tell you, I
know of three people who are going to come down, and 1`0d dike to hear the
answer now.
Mr. Odiot I'd just like to meet those three people.
Mr. Plummert You will.
Mr. Odiot They should be nice people because 1 bet you they don't work free
either. Commissioner, for two years now,, the management team of...
Mr. Plummer: Well, that is not the point. The point is not working for free.
I'm not 'going, into any gory details, but I think are our people... I will tell
you that I think our people are pretty well paid.
Mr. Odio: I think they earn their pay, Commissioner.
Mr. Plummer: I agree.
Mr. Odio: Every penny of it and the misconception out there in the community
is always that public officials don't work. Well, I` got news for you, I come
from the private sector._ I worked in the private sector all my life and,I
remember when I was working there, the salaries were much higher than, the
City, and we worked less. To my surprise, when I arrived in the City, I
worked harder than I was working in the private sector and the bonuses in the
private sector are much higher than what these people receive this year. I
remember in 1973,, if I might tell you my personal story, I was making $40,000
and my bonus was $20,0001... bonus of $20,000 for creating a profit.' I think
you have to have an incentive to be creative and to work. I believe with all
my heart in this system. It is true that we all get paid to do a job, but you
do get a budget approved and it'easy _to just sit on a budget and say, "Well,
my budget was approved and that is what I am going to spend'." But, if you have'
an incentive where you all sudden you start looking at areas that we can save
money from, all of a sudden you are looking at new ways of creating revenues,
and that has happened during the last year, and that is why one of the reasons'
this budget is lower than last year's budget, if you compare them, _is because
of the incentive program, I do believe that, The other thing is, these
people, the management ,team, have not received any salary increases for the
last two years, and it is beginninS to get a compression that is happening now
;
in the case of the Police Department, I know many officers that are making in
higher rank► less than the ,junior officers because; of the union increasers
compared to management increase, There has to be an incentive for somebody to
want to be a major or a colonel, in the cave of the Police Department, or .the''
rs
Fire ;Department and they have got,,.
�.
y�-
Mr.' Plummer. How about an incentive that I want to keep sty job?
Mr. Odio;' Well, Commissioner, there to that incentive' too, We have to
'.
produce, but what those people have done,' to Come up and in a tight budget''
year no was lose year, and with the bonus syotem, that we caved $11,D04,000#
!a ®o.ptembes It M7
c 4
-nr�waklY.9t5,1. -
and the oftly,,,# the bonus that in paid Val 6111 41,60st". These zanagmnt '
people to tat have the guarantees that the firefighters have, of the pol iesmaz
have, or the union peaple have that they ire protected by Civil 'gerviee. they
can ha sent Away at any tiefe"
Mr. Planer: 'Neil, the bonus to 1511174 if t understand t'Oft@dtlY9 the bsea
are 6n1y to the department heads
Mr. 10dio: Only to the department heads
Mr. Plu=Gri Vaal j R, I am just going to give it to you for what it in worth
and I don't know than I agree with than theory, by the way, that you are
expousing. I know that :you have already implemented it, but as the phone
calls that have come into my office ba§Leally say, that you do two thing§, one
of two thinga, or possibly both. You increase the east,, or you decrease the
level of eerviee, and that is how you create a bonus
Mr, bdlo That in not true. Whoever said that doesn't know a damn thing
about management and I would be glad to debate that with them at any time, at
any place
Mr. Plummer: I think you will possibly get that opportunity.
Mr. adios Great.
Mr. Plummer: Mr. Manager, you know, the key to this budget, and I think the
question in everybody's mind is the same and it will remain the same, I am
sure, throughout the year. You are proposing a reduction, yet you claim that
there will be no drop in the level of services.
Mr. Odio: I don't claimitis going to happen. There will not be a drop in
service.
Mr. Plummer: I am sure there are going to be those who will be around, that
are going to be watching, and are going to be monitored.
Mr. Odio: I hope they will be and I tell you one thing, Commissioner, at one.
point, at some point we had to put a stop to the growth of this budget, as you
have said so many, many times for many, many, years since I have been here,
where do we stop? If we don't stop the growth of this budget, the City will
not have enough millage that you can assess to balance the budget anyway, and
it had to start this year, and we have to do the same thing next year. There
is just... we are just to the top of where we can go, and I am concerned about
future years on 'these things that we ` have to do and the only way we can do
this is by being more efficient, and yes, to provide the same level of
services with less. We have, to do that. I was just given the numbers. For
instance, the 'average City employee makes $32,000, with the fringe benefits...
with the fringe benefits, that figure comes up to $48,000, so...
Mr. Plummer; That's not true on both sides. It can't be the same.
Mr. Odio: What do you mean?
Mr. Plummer: Are you speaking overall, the entire City payroll?
Mr, Odio:Yes.
—
I
Mr, Plummer; Because your fringe package in police and fire is much higher
than it is in G.S.A.
Mr,` Odio: The average City- employee with fringe benefit -gets $48;000. Now, .
going back to the bonuses, Commissioner, if we had given the normal pay
increases that had been given in the City traditionally since I have been
fp
here, would have been almost 13 percent. The bonus system was five percent,
!
Mr, Plummer; So what you are saying then, for the record,,,
Mr, Odio; And Commissioner, I want to put this on the record, because the
reporters don't pick up the whole atoriea on that,
w=
Mr, Flummor: N0000000ll
14 Septembor 1, 1997`
te�ee,,
Mr4 Wei you itnowl The five percent that we paid out has no fringe
b"Ortts. it is tat part of the Use. As you .add to your base salary, your
fringe benefits increase and your oasts increases parallel to that. Sa whet
is dheaper to the taxpayers - first of e114 they just dot a ter out _ whet to
cheaper to these three individuals in the numbers, to give somebody a five
percent cash bonus, we don4t pay any fringe benefits on, or to tnerease their
salaries by five percents where sae do have to pay fringe benefits on.
Mr. Plummart Are you saying then for the record, that of ,the department
directors who are receiving these cash bonuses, that they are not scheduled
for a raise this yearl
Mr. Odiot They are not, air.
Mr. Plummert And let's assume that five percent across the board of those
department directors, what would that amount to?
Mr.. Odot I guess it would be... if we gave them a salary increase?
Mr. Plummer, if you gave then normal salary increases, the cost of diving
bonuses.
Mr. Odio I'll figure it out, but you have to add fringes to that.
Mr. Plummer: I understand that.
Mr. Odios Mano, will you figure that number out?
Mr. Suranat_ About $375,000, something like that.
Mr. Plummer: So what you are saying, without giving them an increase in
salary, or fringe, and giving them a cash bonus, you are saving about 50
percent of the money.
Mr. Odio: Yes.
Mr. Surana: Right, and that is for the rest of their lives, because once you
Mr. Plummer: Well, that is this year.
Mr. Surana: Yes, this year.
Mr. Plummer: This year, not the rest of their lives, because I_don't think
they are all 'going to drop dead at the end of this year.
Mr. Surana: No, if you give salary increasesthatthe rest of the
budget.
Mr. Plummer: OK. Mr. Manager, for the record, I was going to ask of Chief
Dickson, but I willaskyou, because I think it is interesting to note that on
the Chiefs'budget of $71,000,000, what additional monies, even though we
understand they are restricted, what additional monies are ,there in grants and
all others for a total combined number of the Police Department?
Mr. Surana It is roughly $17,000,000, Commissioner. That includes roughly
about $13,000,000 incapital improvement projects ,and roughly $4,000,000 in
1 various grants, second dollar, and forfeiture funds.
Mr. Plummer; So the bottom line, what you are saying is, than the total cost,
the total involvement of dollars from all sources of the Police Department is
about $880000,000.
Mr. Surana; Yes, sir.
Mr Plummer: OK► how does that compare with last year? We know what the
number is as fare as the budget, seventy-four, as opposed to seventy-one,
Mr. Surana; it is about $2, 400, 000 less
Mr. Plummer; Lope? OK,
15 September 1t 1907
lr. fdiet Ve ere Also going to be fftte aggressive 61 glans- We have had
etsinars on how to 6bt•aifn here grants. Most dities get 10 psteolit of their
sotlind rem grants and we #to not ovsn aroma to tftr peroentj to this year our
goal to to get iwors grants trots other sources that we have never tappedt
Urs Humeri to here rrw b�b,A-1 10lt, I'll want you fiftts IIr.
,anybody
Manager, I veuld like to ask you, where we are. An you kficV, they have been
raving these public hearings of the parks. As far as the parks are tatestned$
of the 6.2 million dollars that will be spent in the heighborhoodnt
tor. odic, jaek gada was telling the yesterday, he has been very successful and
he tan give you a report on that right now.
Mrs Plummert Weil, that in not the point, t don't want a report. What t
a
want.., Vr. Manager, We have spoke A year, ar maybe two hears about programs
that have been very, very successful in other communities in adopting a parks
Now, that can be done in one of two ways, It can be either adopted by the
community, an we do with Taeoley, we give them "X" number of dollars, as i
recall, and they run that park, including everything. Or, you can adopt it
through, an we did with the J.C. Is in Coconut Grove. We did soma of it
Shenandoah Park. Where are we in pursuing that program because, you know, i
think it in a fantastic program, especially if you can national concern
involved in it, and I think you only have got to get two or three to get it
started and the rest of them will jump on the band wagon.
Mr. Odiot I just saw a catalog by the way which I sent to Jack yesterday that
Miami Beach put out and it is a beautiful color catalog and they have a price'
tag for everything and where you get your name on it and I think we should
copy that, or similar to that and put it Out because it's great.
Mr. Jack Eads: Commissioner, we have one proposal from... an initial proposal
to be followed up by a little more depth than the urban league on African
. Square Park, which looks very promising to us.
Mr. Plummer: Which it definitely should be implemented, if the dollars are
right.
Mr. Eads: Yes, air. We haven't seen their proposal with dollars assigned to
it, but I did walk through, that park at length with Mr. Fair and it , sounds
like a very exciting opportunity for both sides and it looks like a very
positive thing and it is similar, to exactly what you were just describing. We
-had...
Mr. Plummer: What have we done about approaching some of these national
companies. You have got the beer companies that spend millions of dollars.
You have got the tobacco companies. I'm not saying, you know, these are the
companies, but I am saying, have we made any entrees or approaches to any of
these national concerns, because to me, once you get that thing started, the
others are ' going to want to jump on the bandwagon, because they are going to
be in a showcase.
Mr. Eads: The answer to your question is yes, we have and we have had some
good conversations with Coors, I believe and we expect to hear, from them.
Mr. Plummer; Don't mention no names, please.
Mr. Eads: OK. OK, the 'answer to your question is yes, we have and we do
expect some of that to come to fruition.
Mr. Plummer: Have you let the other, in that competitive field know that you
are talking?
Mr. Eads; Yes,
Mr, Plummer; Because I think that is important,
Mr.'Eadss Yes, sir,.
.,
Mr. Plummer; Because they since don't want to be outdone, I hope you will
;
pursue that, Mr, Manager, because I think,.,;
Mr. Qdio: We have other groups,,
4 S t m s 7 l ep e b ,r �, i9$
.
V
Mr. Humeri fiat only Vili gave tie city 'a tat of it"6y4 but it ym
We the right tampetitive spirit going among these 'oammpatties, t think that
you are going to §ss meh better pans, such tatter supervised pa tks and seven
hopefully maintenafteea
Mr. Odiat t have a number for you t,d like to put on the retard.
Mr. Humeri Sure.
Mr. Surana: Commissioner, if we would have granted a five percant lterease to
all the executives, aver five years this would poet the City about 1.9 �nilitan
i
dollars.
Mr. Plummers No, no, no, come on nets, play fair. lie are not talking about
five years, ire are talking about this year.
Mr. Surana: This year we 'save about...
Mr. Plummert The cash bonus only applies to this year, correct?
Mr. Suranat Might.
Mr. Plummert OK, what is the savings this year of not giving all the
Department heads a raise?
Mr. Surana: About $150,000.
Mr. Plummer: Offset just about the same as what we did in cash bonuses.
Mr. Surana: No, no. Even if...
Mr. Plummert Beyond?
Mr. Surana: Yes. Even after cash bonuses, we save $150,000.
Mr. Plummer: All right. I've got to tell you I; still question whether or not
the cash bonus system is the best incentive. I would hope that the management
would give some consideration, if nothing more than perception.- The
perception is that its... you cut, you charge more, and you save, and you get
the difference. That's the perception.
Mr. Odio: Save, yes, you... and you sound like a union leader; that I know.
You save money, yes, by not having people you don't need in some cases, or by
creating more efficiency, or put out more work in the labor force, yes, but
you also create new revenues that we never had, incentives to go out and
really raise monies, where they were never raised before.
Mr. Plummer: But how do you address the question that says...
Mr. Odio: And why is that such a bad thing when that's a common thing in the
private sector, that, is what is done in most, in 99 percent of the companies
that I know. That is the way you go!
Mr. Plummer: If we ran this government like the private sector, we'd be
making money and giving money back to the taxpayers, rather than charging.
r
Mr. Odio: You are right, and that's what we did this year.
N
Mr, Plummer: OK, the perception, Mr. Manager is very simply, OTC?,.. that,..
=;
Mr. Odio: Perceptions are created, Commissioner, I'm sorry.
Mr. Plummer; I'm well aware perceptions are created, I'm just saying to you
that the perception that has been expressed to me is "Well if the savings
were there, why didn't they find them last year at no cost to the taxpayers?"
OK? "If they can save five percent this year, they could have saved five
percent last year."
Mr. Odio: They did. The fact is that the first year, we did save money and
with no salary increase. That is fact. Then the seeone year they. went out
and saved more money, Commissioners after they have had d good year and you
have to have some incentives to,,+
17 September Is 1907
a
L. .> .1r -'df ..<<af.,v.M�.�.f M.a,�.�ii4�Lrv}•
Mr. Plumiar: All rithty D,D.A. The direntor is not availablal
'Mr. Peter Ardollhai Hut genals is 6n hls 'way.
Mr. Plumeri Tau all know of the problems D.D.A. has suffered because 6f the
legislative probitm. Where are you this year and what to you see far the
coming year?
Mr. Andalinat This year the State legislature did approve legislation that
designates D.D.A, for mlllage calculation purposes as an independent district,
which our millage does not have to be added to the City's when considering the
10 mill cap. As far as this year, we are showing an overall increase over
last year's appropriation of $271592. Any specifics, Commissioner, that you
would like me to address?
Mayor Suarezi Why don't you tell the Commissioner about the City employees,
in Planning that will be picked up on that budget.
Mr. Andolina: btt, out of our budget this year, there is approximately
$1600000 that will be going to the Planning Department to cover three planning
positions, as mandated by Commission action earlier this year, and those
positions will be for 'downtown planners to continue work on the downtown
master plan and the downtown D.A.I.
Mayor Suarez: You want to tell the Vice Mayor about the money that was
reserved from last year's budget that was supposed to be used for capital
improvement and so on and what Commissionaction has been. I think we have
_unfrozen that, but I...
Mr. Andolina: Note, on the September_8th agenda is an item requesting that
those funds be released. The total amount was $291,593, as I recall. That
amount is not really available now, because we have been notified by, the Dade
County tax collector that they had included properties in the tax rolls, for
D.D.'A., over the last three years that should not have been included and the
total'' amount that we are going to have to reimburse Dade` County is
approximately $49,000.
Mr. Plummer: Well, you have still got $250,000.
Mr. Andolina: $242,000 that can be released.
Mr." Plummer:' Fine. My concern has to be, based on the history of the last
two or three years, what was the actual action taken of the Legislature?` Did
they approve you just for a year?
Mr. Andolina: No. Last year. they gave us a one year approval. This year
there are no time constraints on it, unless there is further' legislative
action, we will remain an independent district for millage purposes.
Mr. Plummer: OK. I guess 'really, the question is, is based on that whole
assumption, do we, in fact, try to make sure that there is a built in reserve,
in case the legislative action puts you in the same predicament that you were
before.
Mr. Andolina: We have not considered doing that because we have been assured
by _those legislators' that sponsored the legislation that there was no
opposition that they saw materializing, or no 'indication that next year the
total issue would be readdressed, that we had not built the 'capital reserve
into the budget for that purpose. We do have a capital line item for capital
expenditures, but not as a reserve.
Mr, Plummer: What' y if anything has further been done on uniting Off -Street
{
Parking and D.D,A.?
,t
Mr. Andolina: Nothing further has been done, We worked on the $$00,000
.contract with the Parking Authority two years ago and after that we completed
that agreement..,
Mr, Plummer; That was called survival,
�F
A.
S 19 7
I$ PeptemOer 1 0 •. � 1! F
,.
x,
1 f: i1 d iingt After vie teplsted that Agroometty thorn has iSoleR Ina furthilr
format ag rof matt i-stV6161 us. Ve 40 ofttlEus to Vbkk to--gethor 'on proi0ttss but
as tar to tamiltgly the fined§, 06s that hss 'not 'etourrod4
Mayor Suaresi ghat of the entire budget] this to really along the mama line
of 4unationing, is pr6dutod4 vh&t pgr antaga, or what amount is produced from
the actual 'half mill that we typically imposed on that independent taking
district and haw tacit is from other sources
Mr. Andolinat that is 100 percent of ottr budget.
Mayor Suarext How much does that wont out to be in the .present appraisal?
Mrs And�linat $1,�,'8i.
Mayor Suarez: We kopt.s& we can go beyond a half mill, can we not?
Mr. Andolinat Mo) we cannot. That is the cap.
Mayor Suarezt 'that's the maximum.
Mr. Andoiinat Yes.
Mr. Plummer: I have no further questions.
Mayor Suarez: Let me voice the concern of a fellow Commissioner who's not
here and ask if there are any plans to approve the proportion of minority
employees in the department, specifically of Tacks in the high levels, and
high ranks in authority?
Mr. Andolinat We have no plans to hire any additional people this year. Our
minority breakdown has remained constant for the last four years, which shows
a 55 percent of the entire 11 member staff is and will remain minority. Any
money that would have been used for hiring new...
Mayor Suarez: What percent? I'm sorry.
Mr. Andolina: 55 percent. We have eleven full ,time employees, and any...
Mayor Suarez: That includes women, Pete?
Mr. Andolina: Yes. That breakdown is 18 percent female,.18 percent Black, 18
percent Latin and any money that would have been used to hire new, people this
year is now going to the Planning Department, where they are supporting three
positions.
Mr. Plummer: Mr. Manager, I -have a question for you, sir. On the last page,
self insurance, 'do you feelthat the fourteen four, based on the history,
especially let's say the '84-185, we know that medical costs are going up, yet
in 185-186, our costs went down. Do you think that the fourteen million 'four
is adequate?... and how do you explain the reduction between,'85 and 186?
Mr. Surana: Commissioner, if I might respond. There are some budgeting
change in fiscal year 1986. We are making a direct payment to the unions.
This does not go through this fund. Those amounts are reflected, they are
roughly about over $5,000,000 in police, fire, and sanitation budget, so that
,r
number would be about 420,000,000 of the
Mr. Plummer; You mean beyond this figure shown here?
- Mr. Surana: Yes, sir,- due to change in accounting.
k.
Mr. Plummer; Let me ask you this question. It is my understanding, don't we
F
use a private company to process claims?
Mr. Surana; Yes, sir, one,
Ma's. Dougherty; For health Insurance only, yes.
Mr. Plummer;: Why do we have 20 people working in insurance?
19 1907.
4w.N« .,. -.•a . r. ,r ,....i' ..r.x ,. ea r.—n.r rnx.. i < r.4.:... m+.. k s .+- ..n .w.,.w. .,.. w..m...+-.wr+n-+s..:-...,.w...+.r'. —
Mrs, tougherty= 'phis is 16 people that would include nst ,dust the health
tiantanne, Mr. Vitt Mayer, but also all the adjustaral whloh are our Vitt
employses, adjustors and their staff, worker's Comp, We don®t have any
private company doing any of the liability claims or varker's comp,
Mr. Plutm ort Would we ,be smart to considered its
Mrs4 houghertyt We have looked at It in the past, and the Insurance Industry
seems to be going the other way. They are bring in _houses people to scut costo,
and it seams In the industry4 that the better view is and the less costly view
is to bring people in house to to that kind of work,
Mr. Plummert Well, may I suggest to you that in the Florida League of Citios
in which the have the combined pool, they are doing workman's comp., they are
doing , these other areas, you might want to consider looking at the savings
that they have attributed to a number of cities across the .State of Florida.
There might be, either you could adopt their kind of system, or even join
hands with them in their system, because they have in fact, saved more than 20
percent for most of the participating cities that are in their programs.. Now,
we all know that the City of Miami has special problems, but I am saying that
if they can attribute some cities with as much as 28 percent savings, t think
it is worth looking into.
Mrs. Dougherty: Sure, we'll do it. We had explored that in the past. The
premiums that they would charged the City of Miami were far greater than we
were putting in our self insurance fund.
Mayor Suarez: That is true. I have a great deal of interest in parks.
Before I ask that though, about that department, I've got here a concern, Mr.
Manager, having to do with the take home vehicle program of the Police
Department and I thought the Commission had indicated that we wanted to see
anyone who was qualified, met the criteria... right, and that was in patrol,
getting an automobile, I foundout that we only have 30, or 37 available and
there is 44' people that are actually eligible. Can we get that resolved? I
presume that it is just a matter of time.
Mr. Odio: You said do we have 44 people that are eligible?
Mayor Suarez: I think we have either-30 or 37 automobiles being issued and...
Mr. Odio: Well, it is not a lack of automobiles. It is a question where the
Police Department decided they should take the car home, because it is a good`
benefit,' and what I was told that some people, even though they lived in the
City, should not 'take the car home.- Chief, do' you want to answer that?
Dickson?
t.
Mayor Suarez: This list of eligibles indicates 44.
Mr. Odio; If they live in the City, that doesn't make them eligible
completely, as far as the Chief is concerned.
Mr. Plummer: Well, didn't the Commission last year at.budget time allocate up
to 50? five 'zero?
Mr. Odio Yes, we have the cars. The cars are not the problem. It is who
the Police Department felt should and should not take the cars home.
=`
Mr. Plummer: I guess the question is if we allocated 50, why is there only
}
37? I guess that is really the question.
Mr. Odlo; Because only 37 people qualified to take them home,`
Mayor Suarez: But I've just submitted to you a list that I didn't make up,
You know, it was given to me by the Aepartment.
Mr, Odio; Well, Chief, you can answer that.
Mayor Suarez; Forty-€vur people qualified,
;f
Chief Dickson; Mr, Me or , when the y proposal for the take home For program
f:
cams about, there were 35 people eligible at that time, and that's what; went
into to the pr9p000d budget, and ee thorn€Qse, we ended yap with 35 ear; for
20 September 1, 1967
yr,
S talcs home people. R -Ver, lie do have a loot of pratodum and rules and
regulations that a ll to than take -hems proaram. # rookie tl'iat just Lal t Out
of t o seadfi1q, for inntues, vha bas net yet made his probation, v"Ad not
qualify to take a ear beifto at that time, 'until after he has made his probation
and proven his driving raoord to some +�stentr those lieop a would riot
gutomatitally 4ualify for the take-home prograffi, but to get. back to the fo%t
of the question, ve have budgeted for 3t take home 'cars because that is Vhat
tie had available of officers living in the City, rather, at that tilbb,
MMt. plummor3 excuse me, all right...
Mr. Odiot The list that I just saw had 44 names on it.
Mayor Suarea: Yea, the very last... let the ask you about the very last person
an the list.... Virginia Schweikert she is "S" platoon, and she is patrol and
She lives in the City of Miami. I understand that she qualifies for a take-
home car, she does not have one at this point, because you only went down the
list," you used 20 or 37, 1 forget which. Didn't get to 44.
Chief Dickson: No one has been assigned a take -home -car yet.
Mayor Suarez: 1 heard next Tuesday from the Vice Mayor. That means she will
get a car next Tuesday?
Chief Dicksont The assignment, it is Tuesdays I don't know Virginia
SchweikertIs particular case,. but if she qualifies for the program, she will
have a take home car like all the other officers who will be...
Mayor Suarez-. OK, and being "B" platoon patrol, according to sheet that I
have received here from the Miami Police Department, she will qualify. She
lives in the City, I know that for a fact.
Chief Dickson: "B" patrol? Platoon "B", yes, she would qualify for the car.
Mayor Suarez: OK, we are not discriminating at this point.
Chief Dickson: She is an example of those whowouldqualify, yes.
Mayor Suarez: OK, we are not discriminating at this point between 30 or 37
that we want to try out and in the other, up to the number of 44, whatever the
number may be that are eligible. We are taking all eligible and giving them
the take home cars. We have got enough cars. -
Chief Dickson: If we have 44 people qualified to take home cars, I cannot
guarantee at this time that; we will have 44 cars. We will have 35, which we
are budgeted for. If we can find the other nine cars, then, they certainly
will be taken care of, because thatis our intention, but if that happens, we
have to go by seniority, and things like that. But, I've just been assured...'
Mayor Suarez: The crucial question is the crucial issue, if we can find the
other nine cars. Do we have them or not? Let's just get that out in the
open.
Chief Dickson; I would...
Mr, Odio: I have .., .•, Ron?
Chief Dickson: I would not want to commit the nine cars until I am assured
that we have those nine cars available, Mr. Mayor,
Mr, Plummer:- Well, Chief, I guess the question has to be, if this Commission
approved 50.
Y
Chief Dickson; We didn't purchase 50 cars for take-home program,
Mr, Plummer; That is not the point, I am not finding fault with you, I am
finding fault,.,
e,
Mr, 0dto; Yes# that is correct, you approved up to 50 and i asXed why didn't
we will get 50 care out, but we -only had 30 some people that live in the City,
See, because the criteria was they must live in the City.
t.;
21 September 1, 1967
fr.
`
f Are telling that aut of �approtifhat-ely 140'so off ieere,
,61ty 31 lioa Ifl t1is City that are not 5n probatiolil
Mrs Odioi ThAt is What VVe been told,
Mayor $uarea3 h the patrol
Mr4 odio It patrol.
Mr. Plumort #n patrol? Us how Many in patrol, 007
Chief Dickson: ;lust thAt44+
Mr. Plum mer: About 350, and you are saying only lb percent of those people
live in the City, roughly,
Chief Dickson: It WAS a small number -
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER! Well, in addition, there is other criteria,
Commissioner. They have...
Mr. Plummer: No, no, 1 am just making that one point.
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Right, one of the main criteria is he hasn't had a
preventable accident in a certain period of time.
Mayor Suarez: There is 44 that are qualified, are they not, Major?
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: Yes, there is 44 on the list.
Mayor Suarez: OK, so we should be able to make cars available for all 44,
should we not?
Chief Dickson: Well, the more the better, Mr. Mayor, that is one of the
things we're doing, trying to encourage officers to move into the City and
live there and if there is 44 instead of 35, then we will try to provide for
those people, I can assure you that. Before the year is out, those who are
qualified will have their cars, even if it is 44.
Mayor Suarez: And I am on your side. I mean, if the Commission approved all
the qualified ones, getting the automobiles to take home and if it is somehow
not included in your budget, or we have to find resources elsewhere, we will
find them, and it just increases the budget of the Police Department.
Chief Dickson: We are pushing for...
-
Mayor Suarez: We think it is an important plan. I think the Commission said
either up to 50, or simply, all the eligible ones, all right? Either way, we
should cover all 44 of these people who are qualified.
Chief Dickson: I certainly, do believe in and support that. We will do that.
Mayor Suarez: Otherwise, we are going to make the Vice Mayor's car available
and the Manager's and mine and Ronald Williams' car...
Chief Dickson: And mine!
Mr. Plummer: Your car belongs to the City. You leave the Vice Mayor's car
alone!
Mayor Suarez; It's got a nice, plate that says "Plummer" on it, you know,.,
Chief Dickson: Yes, the idea was to again, encourage our officers to move and
live in the City and as many as do that, we will assure them of'a vehicle.
Mayor Suarez: Whatever you do, don't give theta the City Attorney's car,
! because that is what I am driving right now, and it's worse than the one I was
,
driving, Thank you, Chief. On Parks Department, Reis, sir, What are we
going to do with the temporary employees who have been in that department
z three or four years? Are we eventually going to give" these people an
opportunity to become permanent?
22 September 1, 1967
t
•
Mr., tidies They sta rist- tMarary, Unity sro pert tims pospia.
Mayor Suarev cart ttm, Vit'h 24 'and 6na-halt Bouts VeW
Mr; Wei Thiirty*nifis ltourn..4 t slnnit knew it you more bert, Mr. Mayor, Viral
in wets talltitng alert tie nwarags salary fti this City of Miami loyeeg,
$31,001 and Vhan they its pormanatit o layeosi, the fringa honeflto, the
average goes up to $444 10.
Mayor Suarem i understand your phl16sophy, and i fully agree with It Ent.
Mr. Wiwi Maw, we have limitod dollars and you can toil the how you want to
spand those dollars,.
Mayor Suarez, l understand. # understand all of that and t fully agree with
your philosophy to the extent that the people really are needed on a temporary
basta, peeping these as tomporary, or part time
Mr. Odios Part-time.
Mayor Suarez: Part -titre. But, at soma point...
Mr, Odio: We have so many permanent positions, what we should do, as a
permanent position opens, and we move up a part-timer that hat been there for
a longer period of time.
Mayor Suarez: Ott, let's get then to the issue of how many permanent positions
we have in the Parks Department and whether we can somehow bolster that,
Walter, hots many do we have as opposed to last year, permanent, and part-time?
Mr, Walter Golbyi We've got 145'full time people and 17 part time people.
Mayor Suarez: That's for the upcoming fiscal year?
Mr. Golby: Yes, sir.
Mayor Suarez: How about the prior ones? 'How does that compare to the prior?
Mr. Golby: The prior year, we had 160'full time people and 17'part time
people.
Mayor Suarez: So what is the net reduction in full time?... one sixty minus
what?
Mr. Golby: Fifteen positions. But those positions, as they were laid out in
our budget, in a lot of cases were positions thatwerenot occupied, vacant
some of the positions were abolished. We had transfers from the de...
Mr. Odio: They were administrative positions, not...
Mr. Golby: ... transfers from the department and we had...
Mayor Suarez: Were some of them high level administrative positions?
I
Mr. Golby: Yes sir, they were.
Mayor Suarez: Which ones, what titles and what salaries and what individuals?
Mr. Golby: An assistant to the director became vacant. It was abolished.
:>
Senior accountant which was occupied was transferred to Finance.
Mayor Suarez: What kind of salary was the assistant to the director?-
Mr. Golby: Fifty thousand, yes.
4
.-
Mayor Suarez: What is the total salary savings in those fifteen positions?
Do you have that..,
;
Mr. Dolby: SSS0,040,
Mayer Suarez; A little over twenty thousand per, And, of course, If you
reduce by fifteen the permanent positions and don't sepias them, it's a
little tougher to got some of these part timee made, into permanent employees,
' S September 11 1907
r
_t
i
y
Mr. '%61by3 that is e6rr@et.
Mayer §uarset Are you aisle with the. a.
Mrs Wei 'Weil, the part timer would net tbeve to A unter seeowtftatit of
Assistant to the direetor, they would be moving within the retre$tt"&l. parks
matfitenanee field.
Mayor dourest Are you able with the present staffing level to supervise,
maintsitf all of the parks its the City of Miami
Mr. Dolby: Ve have a .number - we have the proper number of staffing. We're e
little more toneerned shout the funding that goes along with that }part time
;
staffing.
Mayor Suarez: To do what with the funding if not for
�` g personnel
-"'
Mr. Colby: Well, the funding, as we see it...
Mayor Suares: You're a personnel intensive department, r presume. Most of
your expenses are in salaries?
Mr. Dolby: Yes, they are. And right now we see that we're looking at a short
fall of about $300,000 in our part time staffing, in order to give the type of
service that was rendered last year.
Mayor Suarezf What hinds of services may have to be cut back or are you
proposing would have to be cut back with the proposed budget?
Mr. Golby: Those are most of the part time staffing that work 32 hours that
wo
uld a d be maintenance type,. personnel. Some .recreation. people that would work
the 32 hours, that type of thing.
Mayor Suarez:, Anything in the handicapped division?
Mr. Golby: We have a special program - special problem in the handicap
program, Kevin Smith has just been - had appliedfor a 'grant and he was
expecting to receive around $87,000, and was informed since this budget was
put together that, that grant would not be forthcoming. So we have a shorn
fall in that particular area of the $87,000.
Mayor, Suarez: What kinds of things were being done with that, or would have
been done with that, that would not be able to be done now in view of not
obtaining that grant?
Mr. Golby: I'd have to let Kevin speak to that, he's very familiar.
Mr. Kevin Smith: Mayor, with the monies that we were funded through the
department of education grant that we were funded this year and denied for the
upcoming fiscal year, we were able to provide the wheel chair sports programs
and primarily the programs for the physically disabled populations that we're
j serving today.
Mayor Suarez: And as of now, you would not be able to handle those programs
at all, or you'd have to cut them back, reduce them or what?
Mr. Smith: Based on our projections, we probably would reduce our total
program by about fifteen programs a week which were currently serving 30-38
and basically we are funded total...
Mayor Suarez; So you're cutting them back to about half of the present level?
Mr. Smith; Yes, sir. We're funded totally through grants at this point and
P"
y.
we're projecting if those '
p j Grants fall short, we're going to have to reduce
those services,
;.
Mayor Suarez; What are they, State grants? Federal ones?
Mr, Smith; Y,es, the grant that where you just got notified of was a Federal
grant out of the Department of gducation.
24 September l_ 1987
mayor suaroat son+t f���et to nt��rdinate with �� 'federal and tat -t sate,
Mr. smiths 'den sir.
Me. Piwmirt gnaw§& as, you're talking about cutting back on _ in the It hour
category that that was maintenance$ tsostly maintenance people. Raw to you a
the 149nagar Said no drop in the level et service. Now, how are you going to
overcome those people 'being dropped free payroll and Still ftintni'n the
maintenance level of service, that we presently have?
Mr. 10albyt For the present time, we are out looking for the3t�8,flOt=t�b,0ati
that it's going to take to fund thosa people to maintain that Sarna level of
service;
Mayor Suareat Where are you looking?
Mr, f olbyt Everywhere
Mayor Suare2t Anywhere?
Mr. Golby: Everywhere.
Mr. Plummer- Yes, but you see, that' not an adequate answer; that's not an
adequate answer.
Mayor Suarez: Let me ask one question along the same lines. 1 believe you
briefed me on certain transfers or cost allocations to the department and I -
refresh ray recollection as to where those come from. Are those - these are
charges, I think, from other departments for doing certain work in the parks?
Mr. Golby: Yes, this would be like ifyouhad an event in a park that, let's
say this group came in and wanted to rent the park, we coordinate all of the
activities between the Fire Department, the Police Department, our own
staffing, whatever the use of the - such as the showmobile and that type of
thing. We put all of that information together, the clean up, and...
Mayor Suarez: But only for special events? Never for routine management of
parks; you don't get charged for that from other departments?
ri
Mr. Golby: We charge for that only if it's something like the cleanup would
have to...
Mayor Suarez: No, no, no, not you 'charging but you being charged by another
department and being included as an intergovernmental transfer by other
departments for routine maintenance of the parks. Non special event type
activity.
Mr. Golby: GSA, yes.
Mayor Suarez: How much is that? How much is GSA charging you?
Mr. Golby: In last year's ,budget, I believe we had around $900,000 total.
Seven hundred thousand came up at first and thenthere was a'supplemental
grant to us to continue the year from special programs and accounts.'
Mayor Suarez: Ok Mr. Manager. I presume in thechargingof amounts to the
l
parks department, from say GSA,' for certain services, I mean it's obviously
not for any kind of a transfer of equipment,' it would be for services of some
sort rendered by GSA, right?
Mr. Golby: Right. Not only to the buildings but to the equipment that we
use, the lawn mowers, etc.
Mayor Suarez: Is there some flexibility, some discretion, some range of ;what'
would make sense for GSA to; charge this department and if so, can we - can you
-.
review that and see what the possibility is of a reduction In the -mount
charged to the parks department end if it makeig sense to reduce that amount?
Mr. 041o; Well, as I remember, the..
25 S ptembet' i,. ' 1907
Raw Surma AM I mew that it cr'eataa a problem in the other departifiatt'e
budget, alwteuslyn
Mr. bdiat I dG10t knew VhAt the directer Is t-alking about, I have to sit .1down
Keith hint after this naetinR on two Areas, and the one thing I do knew is that
gee reduced CIA's tharlea to the Parks Department subatantiaily.
Mayer tuareru What were they befere?
Mrs 'adios What was the number that we reduced?
iNA DIALS DAVOROW COMMENTS)
Mt- tad io t To how much? That's right. tea l re putting ,back into that, in
r
fact* we reduced from 1.2 to 0 and then we want batik and added six hundred
thousand to it.
Mayor Suareet Is it six hundred or nine hundred thousand? I heard two
different figures.
Mr, Odiot Ok, six hundred thousand. So, in a..6 We went from 1.2 to 0, then
we went back and added $600,000 plus the...
Mayor Suarezt Well, you know what you did in between is not all that
relevant, you went from 1.2 to what? = to 5, 6, 9; I've heard three different
figures?
Mr. Odiot To six hundred thousand. To five?
- (INAUDIBLE BACKGROUND COMMENTS)
Mr. Odio: Five, I'm sorry. Five. OK.
Mayor Suarez: Five hundred thousand, for the record.
Mr. Odiot Right.
(INAUDIBLE BACKGROUND COMMENTS)
Mayor Suarez: I don't know what those figures are about. Could you go up to
the mike, Gabriel, and see if you can tell us what those figures are about
here.
Mr. Golby: What he's saying is that we originally had a budget of $600,000 -
$700,000 in this particular account. Before three quarters of the year was
over, we had already spent the entire $700,000. We were then allocated
another $300,000 from special programs and accounts in order, to carry through
the fiscal year. That's in this year.
` Mr. Odio: I'm going to put on the record - I'll sit down with him later, but
he will not have a short fall so than he can have the people necessary to
provide the same level of services that he had this year. And, if not, ,then
I'll have to change the top management of the department.
Mayor Suarez: I want to say that in connection with the; fifteen positions, as
you have explained, and I want to delve into that just for a second. Mostly,
they are administrative, from the way I hear it, in which case I think it's
praise worthy that you have managed to accomplish that; you and the manager,
Is that the case that the fifteen are all administrative or do we have some
actual people that were out there in the parks doing some of the on line work
than were eliminated?
Mr. Golby; You have some recreation people that fit in that category of the
32 hours, 36 hours.
lit
Mayor Suarez: How many of the fifteen?
t
Mr, Golby; No, there's a lot more than the fifteen,
Mayor Suarez; Of the permanent I'm talking about.
z
20 go ptombex 1, 1907
777777
Mr, 16d it1 "Tit f ittfill f1t ASH- it pGa tt Lells Mad fits rea rtat ton t im I f ten Ions
Mayor guarati `dhbre Vera atttuttants atd admltlttratert ttd astittatt
�tlrett+ort, f<o� s
Mr. Colbyt Thetis people Were jdro'ppe'd$ yens
Mayor Suarett Of the fifteen, there Haan not a titglt parks ampityasl a guy
Who is but there just doing maitttnanto or aupervinton of programs,
(INAUDIRts UCIROADUND COMMENTS)
.:
Mayor .Suarez: ices, when you say they were vacant so they could be vacancies
;.
that happened during that one year because the poraon moves to somewhare else
Mr# Golby: Well, gust let sae give you an exaimpl+a, we had.
Mayer Suarez: What, the Job description of some of these fifteen was just a
regular parks department employee that was out doing whatever maintenance
supervision, right's
Mr. Colby: Might, but as an example, we had two baseball instructors. One
in operations, one in recreation, and we only needed one baseball instructor,
so one was dropped.
Mayor, Suarez: When you say you only needed one.
Mr. Odio: Yes, well we don't need two baseball instructors, Mr. Mayor. We
only...
Mayor Suarez: OK, you had two, but presumably they were in different parks,
right? Or they would go around from park to park..
Mr. Golby: They'd go from park to park.
Mayor Suarez: OK, they were in how many different parks, those two?
Mr. Odio: We never had two. We had two positions called baseball coordinator
and we only had always one filled, and so we eliminated the other baseball
coordinator and didn't fund it.
Mr. Golby: We just abolished the one vacancy.
Mayor Suarez: So you had two descriptions but only one person.
Mr. Golby: Right.
;
Mr. Odio: That's right.
Mr. Plummer; It's a paper savings.
,
Mayor Suarez: But we're - really is no savings then.
Mr. Plummer: Sure, it's no savings at all. This is the old Mel Reese
theory...
Mr. Odio:, No, well that's why I want to put,.,
Mr. Plummer: OK,
Mr. Odio: Commissioner, you're right,
Mr Plummer: Yea.
,
Mr, Od o; There is no sense in carrying a vacant position and put dollars to
it when you're not going to fill it, and that's what we!re,,!
Mr. Plummer: Mr, Mayor, fifteen years ago, we had a thing called in buoset,
anticipated solar? savings, and we finally found out and auddenly realized
that that was a paper tiger, and that'@ what we're looking at nowt
27 September 1, 1,907.
m, r. odlej tmt me put this an the records th* poniticit idiers assistmit
directors assistant to the directors senior accountant, perk planntnt
coordinawas administrative assistant tts and administrative al" t--
Mr. bawkinal i4hat page you reading off of'?
Mr. Plummeri Pages don't mean anything in this hook. Miller..,
Mr. Dawkins: 'Wells that's the sheet t need to sees the personnel sheet.
Mr. Plurmmer3 to to the tabs the pages mean nothing in this book.
Mayor Suares: Apparently there were twat what do you call them?- baseball
instructors, and the positions were reduced from two to one. We're trying to
figure out if there were actually two people filling those positions.
Mr. Odio: There was only one person, Mr. Madura,
Mayor Suarez# And if not, then how can you possibly have a savings?
Mr. Odio: because they anticipated in last year's budget that they would have
two.
Mayor Suarezi I see.
Mr. Odio: They put dollars to the position; it was never filled. So it is'a
savings. Now, 1 only want to carry one, there's no sense in carrying dollars
on a position that we don't intend to fill.
Mr. Dawkins: Well, why don't we intend to fill it?
Mr. Odio: Because we only need one - the baseball coordinator.was created
when Mr. Maduro came to me to create the Miami Amateur Baseball League, MABA,
whatever they called it.
Mr. Dawkins: How many parks do we have where they play baseball?
Mr. Odio: They only play in this league that the baseball coordinator...
Mr. Dawkins: How many...
Mayor Suarez: There's got to be more than one park where they play baseball.
Mr. Odio: Let me explain, the coordinator has been in charge of the amateur
league...
Mayor Suarez: Where, what parks?
Mr. Dawkins: No, no, no, no.
Mr. Odio: ... and they only play in Bicentennial Park and in Miami Stadium.
i
Mr. Dawkins: So how many parks do we have where they play baseball?
Mr. Odio; They play baseball, organized baseball, I guess we have forty some
parks.
Mr. Dawkins: All right, forty some parks. And one man can cover forty
parks...
Mr. Odio; No, that's not, that is..,
Mr. Dawkins: ,,. as a baseball coordinator or a baseball supervisory or
base,„
.dad
a
Mr. Odio; That is not his duties, Commissioner.
Mr. Dawkins; What is his duties?
Mr. Odlo; To create, coordinate and supervise the amateur leagues.
Mr. Dawkins; All right, so you're voying to me,►.
20 September 1, 1967
. t.
--JAW,
Ara bdtai And we only have one laagua.
Mr. DaVkinsi to then youlra saying to ae then that in the forty 'parka, there
are no youngsters *he can 'graduate to become amateurs, *to can participate in
the amateur i'eague4
Mr. Odiot Oh yes, air, and we have a very strong.. -.a
Mr. $awkins3 All right, well who helped them?
Mr. Odiat The way it's working, all the parks are fully used, and they are
manned by these little youth leagues, and they have all their supervisors in
place paid by them, and they pay us rent for using the fields.
Mr. Plummier: Miller, let me give you an example. Macu's youngest child is in
Grapeland Heights and she pays, I think it's $6.00 a week for her child to
attend, And they've got over 300 kids in that program. 1 went out last
Saturday for the first time, t want to tell youi some of those kids are not
big enough to hold a baseball bat; the bat's bigger than they are and they
had, I'll bet you they had at least 250 kids and he said that a lot of then►
were away an vacation, but here again, I think that the answer to that is
that all this man that you're doing is coordinating those people because 1
understand it exists in more than one park.
Mr. Odio: It exists in most of the parks that we have baseball fields,
Shenandoah, Curtis, 1 know that..:
Mr. Plummer: I got to tell you, the one at Grapeland is a helluva program.
It really is. Those kids `just really love it.
Mr. Odio: Well, our baseball coordinator, is here, Juan Pascual, started in
the youth system. He replaced Mr. Maduro when he died. And his brother is
the one that created the youth leagues in Miami and is the most highly
organized organizations that I know and they certainly don't need us to tell
them how to run those leagues. But we ,work with them as far as the use of the
parks. The 'creation - the City got involved in creating a league because I
felt there was a void between that youth league - the kids that did not play
in high school, and the kids that never got picked to. a scholarship in
college, so we have created that league to fill that void, and the result of
that is that we had, - I think, Juan correct me, that four of those kids have
been picked by the major leagues now and drafted and are playing major league
baseballbecause of the creation of that league.
Mr. Torres: If I may clarify an issue, the, position of baseball supervisor
was a temporary position that was created when Bobby Maduro was dying of
cancer. We took an administrative aide position and converted it into a
baseball supervisor which is a spot that Mr. Juan Pascual fills today and what
we did was when Mr. Maduro passed away, we eliminated` that position so
basically it was an administrative aide position that we essentially got rid
of
Mr. Plummer: Well, look, it's misleading at best.
Mr. Torres: Right.
r
_Mr. Plummer: OK. That's your problem. What you're doing, you're eliminating
a position thatwas never filled. That's all you're doing. There was never
two people in the position.
Mr, Torres: No, we never said that there was.
Mr, Plummer; So it's just a matter of taking it out of last year's
projections and make it reality this year.;
Mr, Torres; We basically have taken positions that were vacant, that's what
we were doing,x.
Mr. Plum -or; I only have one other question and then I'm ready to leave,
Poop anybody else have anything on perks? Mr, Mayor?
r,
r;
29 September 11 1907
f
,,4
Mr4 psAinat I got tome bitt I'll t6v&r that later beoa"ee came late I ll
not bore everyb dy the with it.
Mrs plumm&tt b1t. ,Can l ask the .Jerry 0ereaull la he herst = housing.- ftfift
again, Mr, Manager, # think 'a l`nt bt these quaations are being gtnerated by
the f4orMAt3 9 S
Mr. $awkinat Vait Q minute -
Mr* pluffnert Sure:
Mr., Dawkingt Mr, Mayor, i maan, Mr. Manager, my concern is People not mAri Ling
the parka and two, not having anybody to repair equipment, OXI Mow we've got
mowers that are breaking 'down, than we say we're saving money because we don't
have meehanies who, at that time but if you've got a guy %664 own a mower and
the sower breaks down3 and we're paying hits four hours to sit thare and wait
until somebody come and fix it, we're not saving money. So we need to
be working with you to try to find a way to obtain either their own mechanics '
for parks and recreation or have GSA assign somebody specifically to_themi but
I,m not going to get into that now because I haven't diaeussed that with you.
But this is what I've been finding from talking to the department that we got
equipment that breaks down, which in nobody's 'reaponsibility; but because we
don't have people, and so we really got to look at it to see how touch we're
losing, but we can't even discuss it until we study it.
Mr. Odio: Yes, sir.
Mr. Dawkins: OX? Thank you.
M Suarez: One more question Mr. Manager a few months ago, it may have
ayor I
been as long as a year ago, and again, it's not a matter of laying any blame
on anyone, I just want to ,pick up on this issue again. We had asked that you
review the number of City parks to see which parks made sense to maybe divest
ourselves of. I was thinking more in terms of the capital aspect of the
parks, you know,, in terms of making a little money, frankly, on some of those
mini parks that are very passive and maybe not so needed by, the City. But I'm
thinking now of maintenance, if you eliminate X number, I think. we ,have 105
parks in this City?
Mr. Odio: We have 105; 46 active parks.
Mayor Suarez: If you eliminated a'few of the smaller ones and found some
other uses for them, including the possibility of some - maybe even joint
venturing with the private sector on building something on them that would...
Mr. Odio: Mr. Mayor, we're following your instructions, the City Commission
instructions, we will have a report...
1 Mayor Suarez: ... or selling them as the Vice -Mayor said.
Mr. Odio: Yes.
Mayor Suarez: That would also decrease your maintenance budget because it
would be that many.',.
Mr. Golby: Exactly, Exactly.
Mr. Odio; Sure, sure. I will have a report for you in the meeting of
October.
Mr. Plummer; Put them back on the tax roll.
Mr. Dawkins: But when you sell a park and put it back on the tax roll, what
do you do with the people who are yelling and screaming at me from Brickell
Avenue who want a parks
Mayor Suarez; Well, we could take the money and put it into the parks
improvement fund because that's the people on Brtckell want to improve Alice'
Wainwright,
Mr, pawXinp; All TM geyinS 1p, and when you yell that one and Shenandoah and
you give `one .to the people on Drickell., we're crcatinga problem,
9 September 1,'1457
I
i
ay tuarset V8114 1 was thinking of thee, mini : t ktiot there1e 6AS
on 12nd Avanue,
14r4 Dawklttsa We114 elabb all bf tb§A,
Mayer tuAreej 116w many mini parks do wa have of those like the ote on 21b
Mr. Odio: We have 4uite a bit of those, l know the one on grand Avenue has
onei aho 22nd Avenue.,
Mayor Suarez: 'That 22nd Avenue Orin, is that Steele PArit?
Mr. Plummer: Steele pant I found out the other day is about a block from fay
-:
mouse.
Mr. Odiot We have about fib of those parks,
Mrs Plummer: Steele park is on Payshore Drive at approximately loth Avenue.
It's nothing but a vacant lot that houses a trail box,
Mr. Dawkins: What's the one on 22nd Avenue between Tigertail and,..
Mr. Odio: Right, that's the one..,
Mr. Plummer: That's the old fire station.
Mayor Suarez: Let me ask, while we're on that the planning director, is he
here? From the planning standpoint, what sense does it make to have these
mini parks all over the City? And what could we do with them that would not
in any way cause deterioration of the neighborhoods in question?
Mr. Golby: Sell them. Put them back on the tax roll.
Mayor Suarez: That's not from the planning perspective, that's from the
financial perspective.
SergioRodriguez: From the planning perspective, we should have 'additional
open land for people to be able to walk to and use them.
Mayor Suarez: But a little bit bigger than a mini park? I mean like the one
that we're trying to create in Silver Bluffs, ,for example.
Mr. Rodriguez: It depends, for example in some cases, for example, like the
case you're mentioning in Silver Bluff, there is nothing, in that immediate
area for people to go - without crossing Coral Way or crossing major
thoroughfares. So in that case it would make sense to have that kind of a
park. In downtown, for example, there might be a needfora pocket park which
is even smaller than that. In other areas, like the one in the Grove, it
might not make any sense`...
Mayor Suarez: I understand about downtown - right, to have a place where
people can at least have lunch and so' on, but at 22nd Avenue Park
specifically, the one that comes to mind there, does that make sense from a
planning perspective or would it make more sense for us to sell that, put it
on the tax roll' and maybe use the money to enhance another park?
Mr. Rodriguez: In that particular sense - in that particular case it might
not make sense. We have an analysis,..
`
Mayor Suarez; It might not make sense to keep it?
Mr. Rodriguez: No, to keep it, right, Itmightnot make sense. We have a
particular analysis,.,
Mr, Plummer: Yes, because you have Kennedy Park one block away,
t
Mayor Suarez; Right,
Mr. Rodriguez; We have an analysis that we had done from the planning point
of view that we will be willing to show It to you ehowina,,.
91 Soptember It 1907
.
HAVer tultgll bobs it ,have a reebmtfidatitti of libv ffiAhl itifit VAtk§ of those
tbould be k6ft Arid lh-ate ffiAhl bliffilftitbtl
tft� Rodrtgutpt, `fie have the ItAfidArd§ that VO Could yea, 'Retierafty yes.
Y6ii VAht t6i We tan AAUS It AVA11fibla to You -
Mayor tuAre,21 Apparently the ftt&gor Is going to make a tbp6tt on thAt4 would
Mr, Rodriguati. Ve were going to do that as part of the c61%Pr§hbft§Iv@ plan
that valre undertakifig now which will be 16oking At the Whole City...
Mayor SuAre2i And then youtirt going to give us a coffiprehaftaive plan about
that big. Couldn't we just get A r6C6%m@hdAti6n On this Particular issue from
you?
Mr. Rodriguez: sure,
Mayor suarezr Copies to us and to the manager for his recommendations?
Mr. Rodriguez: Suref no problerni
Mayor Suarez, Thank you. You scare me with those comprehensive Plana, you
know.
Mr: Plummer: Mr, Mayor, 1 just have one question and here again it's maybe
forrnattitgi.. Mr. Gereaux, in housing? Jerry, we don't have pages to refer
to, so I'll have to refer to the function, affordable scattered sites. Using
the first one, City sponsored scattered sites, three million, three hundred,..
Mayor Suarezt Can you give the rest of us on the Commission some idea where
you're reading from?
Mr. Plummer- It's under housing is the tab, and the function is called
Affordable Scattered Site, number of positions, four; total cost three million
eight. . Just give me an idea, Jerry, because it's misleading as hell when you
say, to implement the City sponsored scattered site affordable housing program
and the community development target areas which will entail the development
of up to twenty-five single family homes during 187-188, to be sold to
qualified low and moderate income purchasers. And then you show three
million, three hundred thirty-three thousand, four hundred and sixty-five
dollars ($3,333,465). If I divide that by 25, that comes out to about
$125,000 a site, and I don't think even under Miller Dawkins' standards that
would be considered low income.
Mr. Jerry Gereaux: I don't care too much for the format either and I think it
is a little bit misleading.
Mr. Plummer: Well, tell me where it's misleading.
Mr. Gereaux: That total project cost, if you'll turn to the page right after
that called DC4, includes the cost of the staff salaries necessary to
implement the program and the fringe benefits, of course. It includes certain
operating and kept...
Mr. Plummer,- Wait, wait, wait. You're speaking of what on the next page?
Mine is Affirmative Action,
Mr. Gereaux; Oh. I'm looking at a different book I guess. I thought you had
the same one I did, Commissioner. DC4 under the Affordable Scattered Site
which is what I was provided. That includes a revolving construction fund,
Commissioner, and that money is going to be coming back. It also includes
fundin-9 for in the amount of approximately $1,000,000 of C.D., prior year C.D.
funding for site acquisition, But..,
Mr. Plummer; Now, excuse me, wait a minute, hold it, hold It,
Mr, Gereaux; Sure,
Mr, Plummer; The second paragraph speaks to acquisition of further housing
sites of $453jQO0 so don't tell me that that is In this.
X_
ft
32 September 1, 1907
Mr. 'sera -Aunts fro, pr-grfim. Wra dnalirig with fibbut sift
'ditr6rent, pr grates 'here, cetfnissioher.
14r. Pluffnfir I'm reading troth,.,,
Mr, hawkinss Hr'. Plummer.
Mr. Pluttner: Y`eej sir.
Mr-. hawkins: Lot's send them back with this and put it in language that We
can understand, beeause this is the same thing l gent through with Jerry and
j
then, when they were going to build semen houses, and 1 kept telling them that
the money they had budgeted was more than what we intended to payj and they
keep juggling figures and putting in figures that 1 don't understand. And
when you ask questions, we still don't get any answers, 1 mean, if you're
satisfied with - 1 m6ah, I'm not satisfied with trying to sit here in a budget
hearing and try to figure out why is it 25 houses will cost $125000 a piece
and when we''re going to sell it for fifty thousand, where the rest of the
money is.
Mr, Plummer: Well, Jerry, under this, and I'm reading from the book...
Mr. Gereaux: Yes.
Mr. Plummer: It says under the City's scattered site affordable housing
development program to acquire is a 'different number of an additional
$453,000.
Mr. Gereaux: OK. OK. All right.
Mr. Plummer: So you can't tell me that it applies to the $3.3 million...
Mr. Gereaux: Yes.
Mr. Plummer: ...`and then tell me that it's included because it's a separate
number.
Mr. Gereaux: I'm reading from the book that I was provided with. I'm going
t'
to need to - can I come back and answer that question specifically,
Commissioner, because I need to get your book.
Mr. Plummer: Well you - yes, I guess.
Mr. Gereaux: I'm doing my budget book here.
Mr. Plummer: All I'm saying is, affordable housing is in the range of, what,
$60,000? Isn't that considered affordable?
Mr. Gereaux: Well, I'm happy to report that we've just received bids on the
first seven units; the ones ° that the Commissioner was referring to and the
bids came in at $42,000 which we're very happy about.
3
Mr. Plummer: OK, but that doesn't include the gift of the property.
Mr, Gereaux: Well, the property is not going to be a gift, it's going to be
financed with the deal and that money is going to come back.
a
Mr. Plummer: Sir, it's a gift when you sell property for $7,000 a lot that
'
]
you .paid $21,000 for, there is a gift involved, I. don'tcare how you hack it..
s
Mr. Gereaux, in that case, a City gift,
Mr. Dawkins; But it's no more a gift than when you give land away ,in Overtown
A
Bark/West,
y
r
Mr, Gereaux: That's correct, Thatla correct,
Mx, Dawkins; We gave land away in Overtown Bark/West so we're going to Siva
land away over there, But like J,b, said, we're giving it away,
Mr, Gereaux: Well, we've yea, and that'a true, We bought the land 00me
time a O but we feel that in the Ion$ run, by improving just that One apacifiC
w�
September 11907
bite, that tilt gift to the lefty is going tb be a "etbUnuing st ,erit 1611 the
part at the Property owners in the immediate area
Mr. I'iummeri Jerry,
Mr. tereaux: Vega
Mrs Plummer: Is not the average, maybe iffy number is wrong anti if it ie,
correct it; is not the average affordable home in your program around $60,00?
Mr. Gereaux: Vea, the number that V6 use before we go to bids is around j
fifty-aht, you're right:. 1
Mr. Plummert OK, sb let's call it sixty. Now, if I take sixty as art average
and I multiply that by 250 I get a million five.
Mr. Gereaux: Wee hums►.
Mr, Plummer: Where does the other million sight go toff
Mr. Gereaux: bite I rant to come back and put this in a format that's
understandable.
Mr. Dawkins: OK, well you see, coming back should not be necessary because I
have told you, the Manager and everybody that when you get - what J.L. is
saying is the same thing I've been saying,
Mr. Gereaux: Yes.
Mr. Dawkins: Anything over $50,0001 damnit, is not affordable and you just
continue to bring 60 and 70 and $80,000 houses before us, Jerry.
Mr. Gereaux: I do not, I bring...
Mr. Dawkins: Well who bought it?
Mr. Gereaux: I bring $42,000 houses to your attention, Commissioner, and I'll
be doing that in September.
Mr. Dawkins: Well, where did J.L.'get the sixty thousand from?
i.
Mr. Gereaux: Well, because ,we used $56,000 before we went to bids. Our
architect provided us with the numbers. We included reimbursement to the City
for land cost and we had, I believe, 12 bidders come in and the lowest bidder
came in at forty two.
Mr. Dawkins: No, no, no, What you were told - OK... what are youtalking
aboutnow?
Mr. Gereaux: That makes us very happy.
Mr. Dawkins: Which house you talking about now?
Mr. Gereaux; We're talking about the seven homes that are the demonstration
program.
Mr. Dawkins: You were told distinctly in a Commission meeting that the RFP
had to 'say that the seven houses must be constructed for $350,000 or under.
So now, if you were told that,
Mr. Gereaux; Yes.
Mr. Dawkins, Mang, divide $350,000 by 25 over there, Where's your -
computer? - or calculator or something. Three hundred twenty-five thousand
dollars by seven homes,
us
Mr. Plummer; ►$pe, let me tell you what my fear is, Jerry, and I expressed
a
this before, you've come in at forty-two thousand for construction, and you've
come in at seven..,
=`
Mr, D4AIns: J,L,, watt, let me go through thie,
l
n
34 September 1, 1907
rx
_.
,,a
{{
14r,, piumtiari `oltj here, let ns just make a point You tams in at sevoii for
the parcel; Wre going to run but of property, There's not going to be much
more free property .and then this program is going to falter and die. And here
we are toastiag about the fact that weree doing affordable housing fully
knowing that the supply of next to tree land is going to ovAparate,
Mr. 'Gereauxt ft, lid like to make this ano point because I believe the
Commission needs claritleatioit on this,, n the original site that we put the
demonstration program on, the seven hazes, the City acquired that site with a
1
building an it several years ago, five or six years ago at least. It acquired
It for housing reuse at same future dato4 The Carver YMCA was on it. It you
take that appraisal and the City acquired it on the basis of an appraisal, and
you subtract the building from it which was demolished as a hapard to the '
community, the land value approximAtes, you know, within 5 percent on a lot
per lot baais, the cost of the bars land that the City bought. Now, i want to
make one other point. in each of the neighborhoods that we are proposing to
implement the programs and it will come before the Commission this fail, an a
neighborhood by neighborhood basis, we're acquiring single family, you know,
empty lots at the appraised value, and that appraised value is going to be
assigned to, you know, included with the cost of the home that we sell to the
low and moderate income purchaser. We have no intention of giving land away,"
in fact, we're going to be using those funds that we got at the 'point of sale
to got out and buy property as it's deemed suitable for continuation of the
program. but in other than this very unique situation on the Garver Y site,
we have no intention of giving property away.
Mr. Plummer! Jerry, if I look at your second column, excuse me, your second
paragraph, you've dedicated four hundred and fifty thousand, is it? How much
is that second. paragraph, I've closed my book?
Mr. Gereaux: For the acquisition of...-
t
Mr. Plummer: Four fifty.
Mr. Gereaux: For the acquisition of land.
Mr. Plummer: That's $18,000 a site.
Mr. Gereaux: Um humm, um humor.
Mr. Plummer: Now, if you come in as lucky as you came in with these seven at
forty-two, and you add eighteen, you're up to sixty.
Mr. Gereaux: The budget, Commissioner, is one thing. The reality of the
t
acquisition is another. That does...
l
r
Mr. Plummer: Unfortunately, the budget is the better of the two.
Mr. Gereaux: Well, I don't think so. I hope that we can acquire many, many
more lots with that budget than we have scheduled, but we do have to have _a
t;
budget.
Mr. Dawkins: OK, $46,000 is what it comes out to if you take three fifty and
divide it by the seven.
i
ay
Mr. Gereaux; Um hummm.
Mr. Dawkins: And when you add the seven that you were talking about adding '
for the land, it comes to fifty-three, Now where did we get sixty from?
That's why - you see, I.,.
�
Mr, Gereaux, That is Commissioner Plummer's number,
t
"i
Mr. Plummer; No, excuse me, that was the number that Commissioner Plummer
u x"
heard the department use as what we were using for a general overall number,
{
And you acknowledged the fact that that was the number you were using.
Mr, Gereaux; Yea, for budgetary purposes,,,
xf
Mr,; Flu-mmer; Yea,
K
S
-
! t-lLerir-si.o
Mr,, feraauxi ... but t -elarifled that by saying that the $proof of the
pudding"' is titan we Ist the bids in 'and we get the product.
fir. 6 1tias: Tss4 but you sees Jerry, it's not you as ch as it is the whole
system. You eet, that's vkat we're talking About over here when they talked
about the baseball instruetar wh'o -did not exist,, It was budgeted tor, ha
never existed and now you're tell no you're saving money because you're not
using it.. Not you$ l mean the administration, OR? Now$ you have here for
budgetary purposes, you got a $06s�66 for budgetary purposas, and then when 1
coma to find out$ it's just budgetary purposes. 3o explanation, no --- # no �
nothing.
Mr. Gereaux: that money will any savings in any aspect of this programwill
bo used to increase the number of units that we produce within that budget.
Mr. Dawkina All we're saying.,.
Mr. Gereaux: I hope we can produce It houses, Commissioner.
Mr. Dawkins: All we're saying to you is, don't tell me any savings. Then if
you expect $100,000, then you tell me there will be a $100,000 from the sale
of this property that will go to purchasing more property. Don't tell me for
budgetary reasons I've put $100,000 here and if and when and what, then we're
going to, no, no, no.
Mr. Gereaux: Agreed, agreed, agreed. We're in the business of building
houses and I think we agree with that.
Mr. Dawkins: Spell it out and then I - that's all and spell it out. I
understand that's the way they've been doing it, but because of a reason...
Ox.
3 Mr. Plummer: You're going to come back at the September 8th meeting with a
breakdown further.
Mr. Dawkins: And with the same book.
Mr. Gereaux: With the same book?
t
Mr. Dawkins: Yes, the same book, so we both have the same book.
it Mr. Gereaux: And if I may, with a narrative that I think is readable and
understandable.
Mr. Dawkins: Yes, but just be sure we're reading from the same thing you're
d
reading from.
Mr. Gereaux: Of course and you will have that well before the 8th:
Mr. Dawkins: Sanitation. - Anybody else got anything else? Before_I get to
'f Sanitation. J.L., before you leave, I've got a hangup with the Police
{ Department over a crisis counselor. Nobody can explain to me what he's doing
and why he's doing it. But I'll wait till the ;eighth for that but I just
4T wanted you to know that, so or the eighth I'll be bringing that up. Mr.
Ingraham, on page two of your budget here, it says, develop and process''
i approximately 800 personnel action forms. Why do you do that instead of Mrs.
r( Bellamy's shop?
za
-<' Mr. Joe Ingraham; For a number of reasons. Number one, for instance the new
's information immigration services forms for one, they are initially processed
by the various departments per requests for mandates of the Human Resources
Department, and several other types of functions that 'carry 'on directly within
r, the department. It has to deal with our daily handling, for instance, of our
99's, stand by laborers and other types of personnel activities prior to n
{` documents being submitted to the personnel Department.
t'
Mr, Dawkins; Is this done by a computer or by hand or by what?
.r
Mr, Ingraham; predQminantlyl right tow, by hand. We're moving to enhance our
computercapacity, but initially it's done by the personnel section of the
department, and then tranasmitted to payroll and other functions within the
#. City that have the more on -lino capacity, We utilize the B20 to initiate the
r
30 September 11 1907
Mr. bawkina: It we over get arouad to temputerisitg the Human Raeources
bepartreent, to there any way that who ever davalt5p§ the. pr6gr:af could putt this
In to the program inhere ones this is headed by you, by payroll, or by
personnel that va eauld punfih it in and fi.ash it out and it would save man
houra l
Mr. tngrahamt Yes, sir.
Mr. bdie: 'yen, air. Commissioner Dawkins, we have four people right now
looking at all the City forn►s. Us have too many of them,, and we're finding
out that too many people have to handle those forms. We hope that within this
year that roe will be eliminating a lot of those forms he's talking about hare,
anyway. but the Computer Dapartment Is telling hie they are moving fast on
this personnel department now on +computeri2ation, rights
Mr. Dawkins: OR, so who ever''§ in charge, send him up there with Joe. And
you are airy
Mr. Bob Parcher: My name in tab Parcher.
Mr. Dawkins: And what's your official capacity?
Mr. Parcher: flight now, I'm acting director of the Department of Computers.
Mr. 'Dawkins: How long have you been in the Computer Department?
Mr. Parcher: Twelve years, sir.
Mr. Dawkins: How long have you heard me yelling and screaming for us to
computerize HRS - I mean Human Resources?
Mr. Parcher: Probably for about at least two years, sir., One...
Mr. Dawkins: And we haven't done it yet. Right, sir?
Mr. Parcher: Well, I think that there is varying degrees, sir, I...
Mr. Dawkins: OK, that's why I want you to - and I don't know anything about
computers. That's why I want you to explain it to me.
Mr. Parcher: OK, where we're at right now, sir, is we're in the process of
testing ,where we down line load personnel information down to the B20'areas,
and at that point in time, we're in a position to be able to generate the`922
right off of the computer screen and then generate that information right back
up to the computers.
Mr. Dawkins: And it took two years for us to do that.
Mr. Parcher: No, sir, no, sir. You look at personnel and you look at
3 payroll, they go...
i
? Mr. Dawkins: No, no, I want to know the only thing I want to know about
right now is personnel, OK? If I go over there right now and want to know who
they hired as a sanitation worker six months ago, they can't punch it in no
computer. They got to go get a notebook, and in a notebook form now in this
day and time, they turn back and see that James Green applied on January the
£. 6th, and then they go to another book and find out he took his physical on
such and such a date, and then they go to another book and find out how much
time he's worked, they go to another book and find out how 'much time that he's
been off, Now this is no - but I'm just saying that - and for two years I've
been saying that we don't need this, So I need to know before I pass any
budget for me, personally, for Computers, when you're going to computerize and
complete the computerization of HRS.
f Mr, ?archer; Commissioner Dawkins, lot me state this, Number one, I think we
have varying degrees of information within the computer right now, What we're
In the process of doing is being in a position to make the user, instead of
our technical staf€, be; able to pull that information out. We've been going
through extensive meetings and trying to come up with software that will in
fact do that Citywide, Right now, the information' that to captured by the
Personnel Department is, in facto captured within the computer, and we do have
mechanieme to pull that information out,
z 37 Septomber It 1967
14r., bawkinsi All right, let 1he nnk you g a§tions Vhen yam eaqwtorlis the
Pellet bopartmolit, &AA w}testt 78,u 'emputerine the #Ira baparttnhnt, did you go
through thane long drawer tut Vrsoesees of httrmisses and we got to put it in
And ratrieve it, is that the way we did its
mr. Parehert Commisslorior 'Dawkins, in my twelve years at ss erienee with the
City of Hiaffiti Vve worked not only for the Police Department but the Fire
—
bepartmont an well. to that it is a process, it's a process at undemanding
what kited of information do we want to pull out of there. the Cost of
retrieval of information is expensive and that's what we're trying to do is to
loth at the trade offs. in terns of those trade offs, where can we come in,
Va try and_antiaipate answers. Those answers and those questions are very
a
diffit~ult to come "up with. I would tell you this, Commissioner, my staff
right now is doing exactly what you have requested to de, and that is to tame
up with the automation of the Personnel Department in terms of where it can be
responsive to the queations of the Commission.
Mr, Dawkins: I'll ask ray question again, sir. flow long did it take to
computerise the Police Department and the Fire Department? How long did it
take the computer Department to do this?
Mr. Parcher: I can't give you a definitive answer. The Police Department, at
this particular time, is still continuing to go through the development
process because time does not stop.
Mr. Dawkins: But they have something to develop on. I don't have anything
within Human Resources to develop on. That's my problem. In two years I've
been asking you, not you, sir, I'm sorry, and this isn't personal, but I've
been asking that department to giveme something that we could build on
perfect and bring about the changes in, OK? We haven't done it.
Mr. Parcher: Commissioner Dawkins, I think to a varying degree, we have done
?`
that. I think that there is information that, when I first started with the
City, there was nothing. It was all done on cards. Right now, you can in
fact, go to the computer, pull out that information that gives every...
Mayor Suarez: No, that was...
[
Mr. Dawkins: ... and in fifteen years, go ahead,-J.L., I'm sorry, go ahead,
't
Mr. Mayor.
Mayor Suarez: It must have been, oh less than six years ago, maybe seven
�.
years ago, Commissioner Dawkins and I both happened to be on the Affirmative
Action Board of the City of Miami. At the time, every so often we'd want to
know how many people in the City were employed and which ones fit under the
various affirmative action categories, and we'd get the answer that the
Computer Department did not have the figures available. That was six, seven,
maybe eight years ago. Now, is it in any way difficult for 3,700
approximately, employees to using existing software that must be out in the
industry with the basic information to be put on the computer for simple
retrieval by anybody, but specifically by the City and certainly by the
Commissioners, if we want to know, you know, when someone, was hired, how long
they worked and then the basic information. You don't have to develop
software for that. That must exist out there. Right?
Mr. Parcher: That's...
Mayor Suarez: For 3,700 employees, I mean, you could almost do it in a mini
computer,
Mr, Dawkins: Lot her get up there — let's grill her too. Go ahead. Take
your licks.
Angela Bellamy; I'd like to explain, ,just provide some clarification, The
ry
Personnel Department,..
k
Mr. DAWkins; You're going to attempt to apply some, OK.
Ms. Bellamy-, The personnels .
�8 September 1, 1987,'
µ
:A
Miela, ern you atavar if new use slave tliat; :list trstrisval
Has tolisttty! I tin snswar :list speaifteall.y, `We do have that, Yost We have
infarmatlet an All turrant lemplaayees, which is what we did fiat have three
Years age.
ftyat Suarm How 'bout lot _ how far back doss? Just turrant employees or tart
we ga back a yeas, two yeera, three years, four years
He. Sellamyl Well, if they're currently on the payroll, we have that
Information. Onee they have been terminated, it shays on line for one year
and from there on we don't have the Information. it's very important to note
that we have made a lot of strides in computerisation for current employees
What we do not have is an applicant tracking system, which is to take the
information from the point that a person applies for a position, for example
in Police and Fire to loot at each step In the process, to look at whether
it's been oast effective.'
Mayor Suarez: Well, you don't have an applicant tracking system...
Ms. Be11amy: Might.
Mayor Suare2t
... you also don't have a former employee tracking system.
Ms. Bellamy:
No, we don't.
Mr. Dawkins:
So what you're telling me is that you're completely satisfied
with what you
got over there, that's what you're telling me?
Ms. Bellamye
Excuse me?
Mr. Dawkins:
All right, I'll say it slower. Are you telling me that the
s
progress that
they have made over there, you are completely satisfied?
Ms. Bellamy:
I think that we're making strides.
Mr. Dawkins:
No, no, no, no, no......
._
Mr. Parcher:
Commissioner...
Ms. Bellamy:
I'm not com... I'm not satisfied that we have a complete system.
Mr. Dawkins:
Thank you, thank you, me either,me either. Thank you, that's
all.
Mr. Parcher:
If I could...
a`
Mr. Dawkins:
And I want to - we're going to work on it and
g g get it completed,
s
that's all.
Mayor Suarez:
How far back are we going to go by the way? Let me just ask
that one question, how many years back?
}
Ms. Bellamy.
I'm not sure if it's cost effective to go back, to get all of
;r
the information back. We do have...
„
.
Mayor Suarez:
I'm not sure either, that's why I want to know. How many years
do you think
it's cost effective to go back?
No. Bellamy;-
I don't think we should at all. I think what we should do is go
forward rather than keep that information.
Mayor Suarez:
All past files will simply be, as now.,.r;
Ms. Bellamy:
Wet we..,
,
3"
Mr, Aawkins;
... null and void.
1
{
Mayer Suarez;
Yea,
t
99 Sdptember 1,'1907
5
;{
Zx
was saamv in geitar-dahet vali Plarida taw, ve havo to keep t1'iin for tavosty
five yearn.
Mayor Suarez: Or -to in there itt the ram and sort at search through A bunnh
of boxag and to ens
tint Bellamyt tie have to keep t'haA for 'seventy five yearea What W re looking
at heoaute W re. a
Mayer SuareaSeventy five years.
Ms. Bellamyi ... tor; I'm sorry, it was p it was changed to tO. What we're
looking at_,,,
Mayor Suareat Thank God for small favors.
Me. Bellamy- What we're looking at now is the possibility of capturing that
information on microfiche or microfilms, some system, rather than keeping
files, because we're running out of space.
Mr. Dawkins: ORO how long you think you're going to take to complete thin,
sir?
Ma. Bellamy: Ve11, it's a joint...
Mr. Dawkinst No, sir, sir.
Ms. Bellamyt OR.
Mr. Parcher: Right now, Commissioner, we're working on two projects.
Mr. Dawkins: What are the two projects?
Mr. Parcher: One, of them is the clinic system, sir, which allows Angela's
E
department to work within and computerize that clinic.
4
i
Mr. Dawkins: What clinic?
Mr. Parcher: The City of Miami clinic which is under Personnel.
Mayor Suarez: It's a rather overblown way to refer to testing of employees, a
physical test, right? Do we treat them there?
Mr. Parcher: No, no, sir. This is the paper flow through the whole in the
clinic of the Personnel Department.
f
Mayor Suarez: All right, just ------- clinic.
r
Mr. Dawkins: OR, all right, OK. How long you say? I mean...
f
�.
Mr. Parcher: Right now we're reviewing the analysis that came out of that,
and we anticipate within a six month period of time, sir, that complete area
will be computerized.
Mr. Dawkins: Six months.
.a
Mr. Parcher: Yes, sir.
Mr. Dawkins: OR now, see, the Manager offered to bring in a consultant ;to do
this, OK? The Manager was told he did not, and if I'm in error he can correct
me, he was told by Mr. Samit Roy, who is not here to defend himself but I will
:r
take it over the telephone if he wants to, that he did not need to bring. in
any consultant, that this could be done. Nowif this is not.done in six
r
months, Mr. Manager, somebodyfs wrong and we need to bring somebody in to get
r
this done, sir, OK, "OK, thank you. You have something else...
Mayor Suarez: I ,lust want to know what the total budget of the computer
,
s
divioion or department - it is a department still?
(iNAIUDIDJX BACKGROUND COMMENTS)
;.
"
a
40. September, 1019S7
Mayor Suarts 'That's piar'tent raitoly 6r tva and -a -half pernerit of the
pity budget
Mrs 'OdW l believe you're going to tilt some ehangen..*,,
Mayor Suarez: You had told n►e that aunt About by any indast4 nnrt'dinly in the
private natter, that's high for aCuter Department4
Mr. fldiai itia A little bit high. it should be one and-a=half percent.
Mayor Suarent Does that apply also to governmental entities such as ones with
Fire and Polite Department
Mr. Parchart to :certain areas,, if l may, mayor, what happens is in eartain
City governments, what you'll find is you'll find the Computer Departments
blended within the organizations. You'll find Computers being located in the
Police and Fire. The City of Miami has a consolidated budget. Because of
that, we may look -a slight bit high. And I say that, slight bit, But I...
Mr. Dawkins: If you're...
Mr. Parchert Pkcuse me, sir.
Mr. Dawkinst If you're providing the services, I got no problem with it. OK?
Mr. Parchert I feel - thank you.
Mr. Dawkinst But the Mayor does. But 1 don't have no problem. But if you
don't provide the services, I got a problem. OK, Joe, what...
Mayor Suarez:_ But the Manager is looking, I'm sorry, Commissioner, the
Manager is looking to reduce that if it makes sense to reduce that somehow,
right?
Mr. Dawkins: You see, Mr. Mayor, -I keep hearing this reduction, OK? Which is
fine, OK? But, we keep reducing, laying off people, you know,` not buying
equipment, not doing this and reducing and reducing and tell me that you're
going to retain the same level of services. Now, I can't buy that, see, but
now the Manager, the Manager say, OK, the...
Mayor Suarez: You know, I'd like to see maybe some departments that are
more...
Mr. Dawkins: The Manager says he's going to do it. If he does it I'm going
to pat himonthe back. If he doesn't, I want it understood that I don't
believe it and if it does, I'll have to come back and say wonderful!
Mr. Odio: Let me, let me - now wait a minute, I didn't say that. I didn't
say that, what I did say for...
Mayor Suarez: Yes,the overall budget of the City can stay the same but we
can - let me just answer his point here. We can transfer some of the
-.
resources, from certain departments that we think are a little bit overbudgeted
if not a lot to those that are renderingthose basic services like picking up
the `garbage and law enforcement in our community which to me - and the Parks
Department which to me are the three most important departments
Mr. Odio; Well, let me give you one answer... this might help, for instance
there is one line item in- but there's one item in the Computer Department
that is stuck with me and I'm 'still - don't know why we haven't changed it.
`.
Somehow,' Mro Roy told me that we had to have twenty four hour police
protection at that door over there. That little line item, Commissioner
Dawkins, cost<$300,000, Now I'm told now, all of a sudden by some magic, that
r we don't need a police officer over there!
,
.1
Mayor Suarez; Twenty-four hour policeprotection was costing $300' 000 a year?
Mr, Mr, Odio; Yes! Sucre because when you talk 24 hour police r y A - protection, eaves
days a week, you're talking seven police officere, OK?
Mr, Dawkins; A minimum! KQ Pometimea the sergeant has to Bo check+ too WSP
t,
had to So by,
Y
kl September I, 1957
j
14r4 bdios AM sdfloUffies, you knar i - ate new that ofie litts item we're
eiietiaattags 'We're alto looking at the pa§gi tiiity _ to itls tat a reduction
-of sarvlee, what I'm saying Is, is cammatt sense tsar Christ sakast Vhy the
hell are we spanding 1-00jbOO at something that we don t even tread, heoatfle
samit Rested Polito pretext tort, Now we're finding out for instant*
Yiisalo ter Dgwieins, that w-heh we moved out of the pallet bapariment, fndved
the eomputara aver to the tecanut breve area, which is a nice area, that we
can also save a lot of money& , and we're looking at that. These are the
types of things we're looking at:
Mr, bawkins# 'thank you. Jibe, what deal reconcile on a monthly basis the
department expendituras as compared to FAMIS for selected Accounts? What does
that meanfi:
Mr. tngrahami Would you repeat that please.
Mr, Dawkins: To reconcile on a monthly basis the department expenditures as
compared to FAMIS for selected accounts
Mayor Suareet You were doing pretty well until you got to this technical tam
famous here, what does that meant
Mr. Ingrahamt You mean the FAMIS report?
Mr. Dawkins: Yes, that's ghat, FAMIS, yes.
Mayor Suarez: Right, tell us about that.
Mr. Ingrahamt Yes, that's the monthly B200 report that...
Mayor Suarez: Well, that explains it.
} Mr. Dawkins: Yes, very clear.
t Mayor Suarez: What the hell is that?
4
Mr. Ingraham: It's a monthly report that's prepared for almost every unit of
our government, meaning agency or department or even City Hall as far as the
Manager's office, or even your office, sir, is concerned that you would
receive that will show your monthly expenditures, your overall cash flow, and
the tracking of those dollars, that you have been budgeted from year to year,
and then from quarter to quarter, and, then the monthly allocation and
allotment, and then the actual expenditure. That comes into...
Mayor Suarez: So you compare on a monthly basis the budgeted amounts against
_F the actual amounts expended.
c Mr. Ingraham: Exactly - that's it, exactly.
Mayor Suarez: Anyway any chance you could phrase it that way in the future
so we have an idea what you're talking about?
Mr. Ingraham: Well, I would if I had that responsibility, sir.
Mayor Suarez: You sound like the executive director of our Sports and
Exhibition Authority, you know, with all the gee macks - is he still around
here?
.a
# ; Mr. Ingraham: OK.
Mr. Dawkins OK, a...
f Mayor Suarez; You're going to drop the "gee tracks" and the agreement and all
of that terminology,
Mir. Ingraham; We'll simplify it.
Mr, Dawkins Last year, there was a discussion as to hiring an ,agency to
collect delinquent feca. What happened? OK, fir. Manager,
k
i�
R
} 42 September It 1967.
-.4
Mrs adiai We doelded to do it tn- b gga t want to tenirstutate Phil LUROV$
t dealt Wift if hs's here er fiat, Wt Vhat they hie d$nt in nolteatiftn is
fantaatles t was told 57 Carlos Marais that wo ir@ doing..s
Mrs Dates: Wait new, va didn't do it in-house.
Mr. Odl-o. Wa did it in-hounas
Mrs Dawkins: Has you all Want out and got a consultant.
Mrs Odial No, tits, no. No, tie, e6ftniuloftor, tie do not have a Collection
adancy for Solid Wants,
Mayor Suareat No, we uned the for Fire.
Mr. Odio: We have it for the Fire Department,
Mr. Dawkina t Dire Department.
Mr. Odio: For the ambulance service.
Mayon Suare2: For the rescue.
Mr. Dawkinst OX, I stand corrected.
Mr. Odio: But,"and I tell you the Phil Luney people are doing a great
Carlos Garcia gave me a report yesterday, and we have collected more money for
Solid Waste than we ever had before. I can give you a dollar report on that.
Mr. Dawkins: All right, then the money that we collected was not in the
budget, I mean not as revenue; what are we going to do with it?
Mr. Ingraham: That money that you're talking about was...
Mr. Dawkins: I'm talking to the Manager, because see you can't make no
4
decisions with his money. Hold on now.
Mr. Ingraham: Yes, sir, go right ahead.
Mr. 'Dawkins: Let me find out from the Manager now.
Mr. Odio: That's part of his budget. That money goes to his budget.
Mr. Dawkins: Goes back to his budget.
Mr. Odio: Yes. If he said he sold $4,000,000 and he only collected two, that
means he had a deficit of_$2,000,000. Now, if we collect four and four, he's
OK. And that's what we...
Mr. Dawkins: Well now, if he got to do it, what...
Mr. Odio: When he took over, Commissioner Dawkins, from Mr. Patterson, he had
r
$6,000000.... thing. Now we only 'about a $1,000,000...
Mr. Dawkins: If he doesn't collect that million, what?
Mr. Odio: Then the department has a deficit.
Mr. Dawkins: Yes and all right, now...
-Mr. Odio: Now we have to make the - the general fund has to make it up.
tr. Dawkins; All right, so this department has a deficit. This director has
been told if he saved "X" dollars 'he's going to get a bonus,He's already
operating at a deficit, so he goes around and chops peoples' heads off, and
`
what have you, fire people, dismiss theft to be Pure that he makes up for this
deficit, and then he 'gets a bonus,
;*
s
Mr. 0019; But he hasn't done that, In order to get a bonus, Commissioner,
they have to present a plan in writing exactly what they're going to do,
Mr, Dawkins; But he's already,,,
?
k
_
p"
43 September 1, 1907
E
v
a
t
i
Mr. bd ia: At no time hall ,, is
Mr. bavktas: Olt, but he's .already a million iri the halt°
ylr,, bd ta. 984 he's vibt: tea, he 1 s a6ta
Mr, hamUtta. You just said if his dan't Collett its
Mr. Odio: No, I waa giving ybu a hypothetical answer. I didn't say that,
that Waif the actual deficit, tommissienor.i The actual deficit of the
department to aer0 right now,
Mr. bawkiasf What_ are we going to buy for capital equipment in this
department?
a:
Mr. bdiot Ron, do you have a list there? I'll be glad to...
Mr. Dawkins: OR, Mr. Williams.
Mr. Odio: icon, you have to 'elarify for sae sometime before the, why are the
new sweepers not working right? I went out the other day and they bounce
along instead of cleaning it. They look like bunny hoppers; but they're brand
newt The old ones are better.
Mr. Dawkins: They look worse than that. They look worse than that.
Ron`Williams: Commissioner, we have a projected heavy equipment replacement
schedule here for fiscal year 188 that includes, if I may, just go through
some of the high points.
Mr. Dawkins: Don't go through all of them, sir, please.
Mr. Williams: OK. I most certainly will. Twelve garbage trucks scheduled to
i
be replaced.
t.
Mr. Dawkins: By when?
Mr. Williams: During fiscal year 188.
Mr. Dawkins: OK.
i
i
Mr. Williams: Which means we will probably be getting that package of
specifications out early fall, so that we can have that equipment ,in service
toward the beginning of summer.
b
Mr. Dawkins: We're talking about how much money, sir?
'
Mr. Williams: Our projection on that is$688,000.
Mr. Dawkins: OK, go ahead.
r
Mr. Williams: Eight open rubbish trucks, projected expenditure, $281,000.
Mr. Dawkins: OK.
Mr. Williams: Those are the units that are scheduled to be replaced,
Commissioner. However, we've been talking with the department about several
other areas that would not be identified as pure replacement items, but would
-
be items that they ,need to enhance their ;own collection activities and
programs, i.e. things like backhoe equipment, utility type equipment - as you
g,
know, during this fiscal year, we've improved their crane availability by a�
couple, and we're looking at the opportunity to continue doing that. That's
essentially at this point, a summary of what we're planning to replace.
Mr. Dawkins: Then this million dollars is budgeted where? For this capital
r;
equipment.
Mr. Williams. It will obviously have to be budgeted in the General Services
}
Administrat.ion and funded from certificate notes.
{
Mr, Pawkinc, From certificate noted,
44 September 1, i9i37
77777
Mr,
'Wi i l ietttts t
742.
Mrs
bawkiRe:
All right, Wat is ttig nurrain amount of mulay in tita, at:d now
t need Matte or tamobady, iri tts bond issue sari i i 'what is it nal lad, vat's
the
affinial_name at it? 14r, gladeee, vhat'a tho affinial name?
Mayor auaras#
They're carttfinata dotes, by the v&y.
Mt-
James 816dsee! in the bend part of the CiiiF1, itls call4d central bonds
Fiduciary control bends
Mr,
Dawkinat
Fiduciary central bonds? tuft, hold ant All right, naW, what
�
part are you talking about naming fretn?
Mr.
Wiiliamat
I'm talking about certificate of participation notes,
Mr.
Dawkins:
Certificate of participation Stotts.
:.
Mayor Suarett
Those are loans like any other loans new.
Mrs
Williatnst
Fasi airs
Mr:
Dawkinst
OXj all right, participation.
Mayor Suarez:
They have a nice fancy namei but they're just borrowing money.
Mr.
Dawkinst
What is in the pollution control bond dollars?
Mr.
Williams:
I don't know that one, Commissioner.
Mr.
Dawkins:
Somebody.
t
Mr.
Carlos Garcia: The projected balance...
Mr.
Dawkins:
Now, wait a minute. What projected?Why is it projected, sir?
f
Mr.
Ingraham:
Well, there are certain funds that are already committed.
Mr.
Dawkins:
Why?
Mr.
Ingraham:
Under, your C.I.P. projects of the City, you have funds that are
already earmarked for certain projects.
Mr.
Dawkins:
Out of pollution control bonds?
Mr.
Ingraham:
Yes, air, these are...
Mr.
Dawkins:
That has nothing to do with the Sanitation Department.
Mr.
Ingraham:
No, these are Sanitation Department projects.
+
Mr.
Dawkins:
Go ahead. What are they?
Mr.
Ingraham:
I don't have the C.I.P. project in front of me, sir.` The total
numberthat's
available right now is approximately .$2.3 million dollars.
About $2 million dollars.
Mr.
Dawkins:
Two point three, What happened to the three? You said two
point three, now somebody say two.
'
Mr.
Ingraham?;
Wellp thereabouts, air, we don't have the exact ,fisure in
`
�.
front of ut;.
:..�
-
Mr.
Dawkins;
Well, round it to two point three, Don't round it at two point.
Mr.
Ingraham?;
Two point three then. We'll round it to two point three.
P
Mr.
Dawkines
Mecause we're rounding offs OK?
A
Mr.
Ingraham?;
We'il round it o€f to two point three,,
r,
45 Peptemter 1, 1967
l-
Mr. 0mokins, All right. 14ov, this 15ottuttnn ttntrat Lund, Uri Haft istabi
used for v itat? t4r4 msirtaa
Major Suares3 What were they apprevad by the way? They were 4,D4 t bads?
Mario turanai t %uses for baying equipment, anything that has to to with th
Sanitation Department
Mayor Suarm When were they approved, Nano? - ANong AN we're into that?
Mr. biedsoet the bond issue took place in 1970$ and it WAS a 0.0,7
Mayor Suares: flow big was the initial amount of the issue?
=
x
Mr4 bladsoet seven million dollars.
Mayor Suareai And we have how much left of that capacity?
Mr. 11edsoet We had four million dollars. We had sold three Million dollars
of those bonds. We have a remaining balance of four million...
Mr. tngrahamt Jim, you've got to come to the mike so they can record it,
Mr. bledsoet 1 know Carlos may be better at giving you all of the figures...
Mayor Suarez: And don't tell us about the selling of the bonds so much as
Carlos has, how much we have actually spent because sometimes we sell bonds,
we keep the money in-house. I mean, it was seven million approved? How much
has been spent of that?
Mr. Garcia: We sold those six point seven million dollars in bonds and we
-'
sold -------- trillion dollars last year.
Mayor Suarez: We borrowed the money?
Mr. Garcia: Right.
Mayor Suarez: OK now how much have we spent?
Mr. Garcia: I don't have that appropriation in front of me, but I believe we
still have about four million dollars to be spent. Most of that has been
appropriated by now.
:
Mr. Dawkins: Appropriated to what? What equipment?
Mr. Garcia: I know that at least there is a million dollars appropriatedfor
}
equipment, and I don't have those numbers in front of me, but Joe may have
4
them, or you, Jim.
Mr.' Dawkins: All right, I want it clearly understood from my point of -view,
4
OK? You all got four million dollars to buy sanitation equipment with, OK? I
expect it to be purchased and purchased in a hurry. All right? With the way
you all are cutting back here, talking about you're saving and reducing
services" and cutting the millage, money is going to be hard to come by. I
want, me personally, now I don't know about three, and I need two more members
on the Commission, I -don't know, but I want you people to buy the equipment
that we need to provide sanitation service that we need in the City of Miami.
Because next year - I'm not concerned about this year, because we're doing
wonderful and the citizens are going to vote, Hooray for Ferre, Hooray for
Suarez, Hooray for Plummer, Hooray for who ever else, see. But next year, is
4
an off year,..
Mayor Suarez; They'd better not vote for Ferro.
Mrs Dawkins; Next year is an off year, everybody's going to be running around
trying to find out what's what. The garbage will not get picked up. You're,
t'
going to want to raise' peoples taxes to buy equipment and Miller Dawkins has
go to run in 189, Now everybody's; mad with me. When 1 didn't do it, QK? So
rj
buy all the equipment you can buy this year, so that in 109 I can tell people,
}
wollp I bought all I could when wo had the 'money,
Mr. Ingraham; X@a, sir, consider it done.
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46 September 1, 1907
Er:'
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Mayor tuarw J614 tine gift another what* set tf questions here having to to
with the multifa lly waste piek tip, 16e
Mr. tngrahaml Yes, air,
Mayor Suarapn Vm a little canfusdd at, to ghat we were doing in the past and
what we're dieing tow. t have a pretty good idea an single famtiy and dupleaes
°
and I have s rough idea an commercial establishments, end what we attentipte6 to
do by having .a minimum fee and creating an incentive for them to use our
system, And it didn't 4uite work out that way, but Va sure you're raw
preparing some kind of a tee schedule that is tatpetitive, to that twofircial
eatablishments ten also take advantage of cur, you knaw$ fixed costs, and the
feet that we're out in the streets, and the fact that the marginal cost of
picking up some additional garbage may scat be oo high, end we may be able to
compete with the private 'sector, Sort of reverse privatiaatim as t call it,
a
Now, and which could lead. to increasing your overall work force; ate., etc,
Hopefully, it will. Now, multifamily residential I am totally confused about.
What was the charge prior to the new ordinance that we passed. I mean, not
any modifications of the new ordinance but prior to my tenure, what was the
charge for a multifamily complex of four or ,more units lots say and were they
obliged to use the City systmi Were they not? - and were they charged on a
per unit basis $160 a year, like a single Emily residence or a duplex and
what is the system now? What are we proposing to theta now?
Mr. Ingraham: In reference to those four elements of your question, I'll
start with what's being done as far as the, what you're referring to and
relative to the $150 fee.
Mayor Suarez: No, no, no, no. Don't want to get into that.
Mr. Ingraham; That's not what you're talking about?
Mayor Suarez: The multifamily residential. What was it prior to your tenure,
let's say.
j
Mr. Ingraham: It was $310 Per annum, sir..
. -
Mayor Suarez: Up to what level? I mean if it was a hundred person - hundred
Y,
unit building?
3
Mr. Ingraham: No, per unit, it was $80 per unit.
Mayor Suarez: Eighty dollars per unit and what's the $310 figure you're
giving me now?
Mr. Ingraham: Well, the $310 was in reference to what we would call a
commercial unit. In reference to an apartment complex or...
Mayor Suarez: Right, that's what I'm talking about. Residential, multifamily
residential.
Mr. Ingraham; ... something of that nature, it was $80; $80 per unit.
Mayor Suarez: No matter how many units? There was no economies of scale, or
anything like we didn't say, if you have a hundred units, you have to pay a
r
little less per unit or anything.
Mr, Ingraham: No, air, No, air.
Mayor Suarez; Or depending on how much- how many of the containers you have
out there and everything bike that,
Mr. Ingraham; No, sir,,.
B
a
Mayor Suarez: It was $80 per unit flat:.
r.
Mr. Inorahom. Prior to my, tenure that had not boon done.
Mayor Suarez: And that applied from how many units up? From four units?
r.
l"j4
k? September 1, 19$7
.t
M#. ffi fAh' t three units j1p. Ursa or %oroj fell 11r, it Vft iS0 r,
'.
Mayor Suararn hell, the problem Vit � that is that, nee-Ans that three
/that
,units v6uld $ay 20 Vhereas two units v8uld Pay .$j 320,- Ynu got A prohls�n
there. Don't toil quo we're doing tbat.i
Mr, Ingraham Valli that's what t %#&hti.i-
Mayor .Suareet I knov that the two Units are paying $120 heosuse they' you
know, I walked house to house and they were telling one that -
Mr. Ingraham 'Eight, that's correct -
Mayor $uarest And than three units would pay $2401 96 if you added a unit
you could pay a little less
:.:
Mr. Odio: Vait, wait, Mr. Mayor. Can I point something out, the two units at
three twenty,
Mayor Suarez: Yes,
Mr: Odiot The county..,
Mayor Suarez: I know it's less than the county.
Mr. Odio: ... for a homeowner pays $300.
Mayor Suarez: I know, but if a guy has two units and he's paying $3201 he
talks to his neighbor who has three units, he's paying $240, we've got a
:
problem there.
Mr. Odio: There's something wrong with that, I...
Mr. Ingraham: We're, right now, Mr. Mayor, we're presently and we meaning...
Mayor Suarez:Prior, prior to your taking over, because I want people to know
just how confusing things were in the past.
sr,
Mr. Odio: Oh, OK, go ahead and give him the...
`
Mr. Ingraham: Prior to our taking over, sir, let me regress. It was indeed a
situation where there were six or more units, OK?
Mayor Suarez: OK:
Mr. Ingraham: And reference to the application of that particular fee.
Mayor Suarez: And how about between two and six, was it - between two units
and six units, say four units, how much did they pay before?
Mr. Ingraham: In that regard, it was $310, OK? Anything less than the six or
more was $310 per annum.
Mayor Suarez: Even though a two unit duplex was paying $320,
Mr. Ingraham: That's the way it was structured prior to my tenure, air.
Mayor Suarez:` I guess part of the reason was that they get different kind of
pick up. I mean in a multifamily they're supposed to provide the container,
and it's supposed to be picked up right from the container, I presume, right?
Mr'. Ingraham: That is optional, sir. It depends on the property owner,qw
Mayor Suarez: OK, now, were they required to participate in the City's'waste';
collection system, or could they have used their own?
xr
Mr. Ingraham: In the past, they had been exempted, as far as that
concerned, and,,.
Mayor Suarez: In other words, they could use their own,
'a
4$ Oeptemlev lr 14$7
C
ti7Tq.}
7
1*10
Mr: bigribami tf Ue7 vaiited to go with a private haulier, they Could have
grattofi art exteption through the diraotor's offito of the deportment.
Mayor SuAnzi And that's for six or Fiore units,
Mr, Ingraham: Tres, air9
Mayor Suarea, Hov about tow?
x_
I
Mr. Ingraham: That wad previously, Mow it's three or more] meaning four
Y
Mayor Suarept. OR, four units or more* what options do they have now? No
optionsg they have to go with our system? Or they have an option?
Mr. rngraham: They have some option, and what we're trying to do and we're
working on it right now, is provide them with what looks to be competitive as
far as other arenas are concerned,
i%
Mayor wares: We're trying to compete with the private sector?
Mr. Ingraham: Were trying to provide theta some alternative.
Mayor Suarez: Olt, but what are those alternatives? Can they not participate
if they don't want to, and not have to pay us anything and just go ahead and
continue with private companies?
Mr. Ingraham: They can, that's per the code there is...
Mayor Suarez: I mean I know we'd like them to use our system but can they -
OK.
Mr. Ingraham: They can per the code if they can continue to show a viable
contract with the private hauler, and they already had it in existence and
it's continuing, yes.
Mayor Suarez: Beautiful. Now, how are we competing with the private sector?;
What are we proposing to charge per unit on four or more units?
Mr. Ingraham:As it exists right now, and again I state we're working on
that, the...
Mayor Suarez: You're trying to come up with a fee- schedule that's
competitive, right.
Mr. Ingraham: We're coming up with a fee schedule that's competitive, and
we're trying to have commercial entities go to, what we would call,
containerized collection. Meaning, rather than the cans...
Mayor Suarez: But now you're confusing me when you talk about commercial
entities', I want to stick to multifamily residential. Do you call those
commercial?
Mr. Ingraham: Even - 'yes, sir, that's commercial, and especially in that
regard` if it comes out cheaper for a person to consider to buy two or utilize
a two, four or more yard container.
Mayon Suarez: OK, your idea, Joe, is when we go to a system that give - a fee
schedule that's competitive, to do it at the same time for commercial
_
w
establishments as for multifamily residential.
Mr. Ingraham. Yes, sir.
Mayor Suarez; OK. And we're not going to charge theta a basic fee if they
don't use the system necessarily. We don't know what we're going to do with
that► I guess.
z�
Mr, Ingraham:' That's what we're working on.
Mr, 0019: We're working on that because,..
Mayor Ouaxar,! But whatever we charge theta, If we now impose a' mandatory fee
for not Uping our 6711tem► we got to make aura that if they eeleot QU oydtem,
that i be competitive.
is
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49 Soptemberr 1, 1907
r:
_ _ —_ ._ ____ .�......,r... ._..... W....,..u..._..:._........_..�_......... ... j a v�1,
i3
Mr. tfigrahau=. T46114 airs I Assurs you thgt it will.
Meer gwarov $gtmas ath'arwim they say :all of a sudden wa have .A 'tee we
didn't have before for tat Participating iit t sVstdm,
Mr. hgrahamg correct.
Mr. Wei I'm discovering, Mr. Mayar, i reda around with Ran nelson one daY,
and Midst fat the containers there had been over opilltd and there were
aompiaifite that we were not picking up garbage, were not ours, they were
commercial pickup, and we had to sand our inspectors there to that property,
and tares them to call a private hauler and clean up that sidewalk,
Meyer Suarati I understand that. I think it makes some sense to say, if you
don't use our system at ail$ we're still going to be having to pick up around
you and we're going to have to charge you a basic fiat fee.
Mr, Odio3 We do, we have t'o do that.
Mayor Suarazi gut then we have to say to them, at least that's whet you have
said to the Commission, that if you choose to use our system, the total amount
you're going to pay in competitive with the private sector.
Mr. Odio: in some cases, even better than the private sector.
Mayor Suarez: And even betters
Mr. Odio: It is.
Mayor Suarez: Well, that's even better competition and then we'll - all
right.
Mr. Odio: I think we gave up our right in that past when we said we were not
going to pick up commercial, somebody made that decision. The City under the
Charter, we have the right to say no, we're going to pick it, up and we pick it
up, and we have that right by whatever...
Mr. Dawkins: Do we - how do we regain that right, Madam City Attorney?
Mrs. Dougherty: It's possible to pass an ordinance providing that all garbage
pickup will be provided by the City of Miami and, if you don't use City of
Miami services, you still have to pay'a City of Miami fee.
Mayor Suarez: Some basic fee.
Mrs. Dougherty: Now the, problem with that is obviously that you have to have
the ability to pick it all up.
Mayor Suarez: Joe, just one last question.
Mr. Ingraham: Go right ahead.
Mayor Suarez: I saw the report - I guess we all saw the report on Channel 4 -
about Channel 4 not paying the kinds of fees it should have been paying for
t:
these many years, right?
Mr. Ingraham; Yes, sir,
j?
Mayor Suarez; And they were doing a nice report on themselves which we
appreciate, have we straightened up that problem? Are we now charging that
the amounts in question to major commercial enterprises like Channel 4 and all
pG
the other one's?
1
Mr, Ingraham, What we have done in that regard to the tune of a task force
that the Department of Management and Budget in conjunction ,with myself
spearheaded, we have benefit the revenue,o€ the City in reference to going a
step further, What Channel 4 did not say is that during the course of their
report, they, refused to go into my conference room to ;199X at what we were
doing to update our Accounts 'while they were carrying on that particular
p And i appreciate your question, �o date, weave i�Qk�d at over 10,OpQ
rs ort,
e vunte, and hove adjusted them to the tune of in excess around °$000,000 dr
4i
r,
50 September 1, ' 1987
... iI
•
$S003'0 4 Vtth tbm Potential of ttAing at Approximately 0106b there UtbUttl;
to soon as we tat vatout same tunvavir needs to het It dohs,
,Mayor Suamai when you §aid mivatted your termlnnlogy natty is A bit t6o
aubtle for ma tow.
fir', tngfaham: Wire looking at Where pts —Pit vets being —
Mayor Suarea: floes that mean that we've holleet6d some of this m6nieYt
Mr. Ingraham.- Y60t the moftey'll Coning IN it's pe6plh Whose achounts were
improperly billed.
Mayor guarea: HOW much have we Collected
Mr. Ingraham i. Mr. Ga'reia can address that. Ve identified about a half a
million in reference to what the difference was between whet they should have
been paying.
Mr. Dawkins: 136w touch ever did you collect?
Mayor Suarez: Any penalties or anything in connection with that? You can4t
really charge theft penalties if you didn't bill theta in the first place;
right? Right.
Mr. Ingraham: It would be very difficult to do that
Mr. Garcia: We started to send those bills this year effective January lst so
we're billing this year an additional $600,000 and, we have collected part of
those bills as we collect those as they come in throughout the year. So...
Mayor Suarez: You're ,very good at getting that extra penalty when individual
homeowners don't pay their fee. I know, because you've sent me the 'eighty
three dollars all the time with the 'extra $3.00 tacked on.
Mr. Garcia:Right.
Mayor Suarez: Now, and that's fine, and I hope that you treat large
commercial establishments with the same kind of kindness and so on. But, I
hope that youdon't go overboard now, because I hear some people being' -
receiving billings that go back three and four years, where the City says, we
weren't' billing you the right amount. It sounds like,, you know, FPL and so
on, and I'm not sure we should be doing that.
Mr. Garcia: We did thatlastyear to the tune of a million dollars. We had
to do that because those accounts were not billed for many years, and we had
to work them out one by one.
Mayor Suarez: How far back are you going?
Mr. Garcia: We stopped doing that. That has been done. That was,
-accomplished last year.
Mayor Suarez: How far back were you doing it? How many years back?
Mr. Garcia: We did that for up to five years.
Mayor Suarez:, Did you give them an opportunity to pay in the same span of `
time that they were not being billed like FPL does?
Mr. Garcia: Yes, we did. We gave them a payment plan - that is right, yes,
.;
sir,
" Mayor Suarez: And those are not - those include some small two and three unit
complexes, not just major commercial ones like Channel Four,
d
. Mr. Garcia; That is right. That is right, year air. The services were
' provided by the City, and that was an amount due to the City,
Mayor Suarez; What kinds of reasons and for the benefit of the media in case
they're interested in going back to the things that ware not dope right in the
past, which I hopes they emphasize, Whet kinds of thins were leading up to
Bm �
bl SaptembOr It 1907
.
x,n7 . wz...t A^n. .-n •. -.-- rr .a G w.^r.r•n X-ms. ,v.. .; < ^>. n n... r'r .L Yfiit^riEjft
r.
i
a� � �i' tlS thA p�stefiti i iA61Elftl At a�pral 11fiAt�ely I&I010 a ros •Afteuntss
as soft AA we en Vark out son n' Ati bVef finda to get it d"s.
Mayer Suareas when you said adjusted your tirmincitgy alAtri is a bit too
subtle for no tiay.
Mr. Ingtahamt Valre loiokiig at amounts where people were be tg,.s
Mayor tunreaf Doers that mean that we've collected 86me Of this Money?
Mr. Ingraham: Yes, the money's coming in,; it's pe�pl+e wi�6se accounts were
improperly billed.
Mayor tuareas How much have we collected?
�r
Mr. tagrahams Mr. Garcia can address that. We identified about a half a
million in reference to what the difference was between: what they should have
been paying.
Mr. Dawkins: How much aver did you collect?
Mayor Suarez: Any penalties or anything in connection with that? You can't
really charge them penalties if you didn't bill them in the first place,
right? Right.
Mr. Ingraham: It would be eery difficult to do that.
Mr. Garcia: We started to send those bills this year effective January lot so
we're billing this year an additional $600,000 and we have collected part of
those bills as we collect those as they come in throughout the year. So...
Mayor Suarez6 You're very good at getting that extra penalty when individual
homeowners don't pay their fee. I know, because you've sent me the 'eighty
three dollars all the time with the extra $3.00 tacked on.
Mr. Garcia: Right.
Mayor Suarez:. Now, and that's fine, and I 'hope that you treat large
commercial establishments with the same kind of kindness and so on. But, I
hope that you don't go overboard now, because I hear some people being
receiving billings that go back three and four years, where the City says, we
weren't billing you the right amount. It sounds like, you know, FPL and so
on, and I'm not sure we should be doing that.
Mr. Garcia: We did that last year to the tune of a million dollars. We had
to do that because those accounts were not billed for many years, and we had
to work them out one by one.
Mayor Suarez: How far back are you going?
Mr. Garcia: We -stopped doing that. That has been done. That was
accomplished last year.
Mayor Suarez: How far back were you doing it? How many years back?.
Mr. Garcia: We did that for up to five years.
Mayor Suarez; Did you give them an opportunity to pay in the same span of
time that they were not being billed like FPL does?
Mr, Garcia: Yes, we did. We gave them a payment plan - that is right, yes,
sir.
,
:.,
Mayor Suarez; And those are not ,- those include some small two and three unit
r;
'
complexes, not just major commercial ones like Channel Four,
q:
Mr, Garcia;. Than is right, That in right, yes, air, The 'services were
provided by the City, and that was an amount due to the City,
el
Mayor Suarez; What kinds of reasons and for the benefit of the media in
thoy're interested in &bin$ bock to the things that were not done right In the
past, which l hope they emphasize, What kinds of things :were leading up to
51 September It .1987
i
}
f
m+*wk�-n^d+na�f�w.4tleohlMrtT(.wsv�ti-
thatl= into Vs fiat VhAt ktnds at alstakes vor@ ` 11.1'g lude that tertats
018op'1f veto flat petal btliod this aarreet mounts It this -Pasty
Mr. oaretal Thsse seasunts hate VhAt wo- called :an exempt status. They vote
tndieattd sa not being billed when this syettm vat transferred from :Baled (taste
A eaUp16 of years Aga to ytnanne Va atarted to work an those aeeaurits an a one
to ane basis, and we found out that the serviees veto being prevtded.JJ
Mayer guarea: two lacatians ire gust didn't knew that they were ther&I
Mr, tarcia: Satnahov the aecaunt was astamptedJ
Bayer Suareat Wa had not inventoried then or whatever.
a
Mr. Garciat Rights
Mrs Dawkins, What probably happened, Mr. Mayor, is that the computer never
changed when they, you know, went from a vacant lot and the people pulled a
Hermit to build a house on, nobody never went back and upgraded the computer
and say that a house is Here now. It's no longer a vacant lot and we should
be collecting)
Mr. Odio: Do you want me to tell you about the computer? The computer was
owned by Jim Boargman, who was the assistant director. He had a Apple
computer in his office, and that's how they did the billing, and when he deft
he left with the computer.
Mayor'Suarexe He took the Apple with him.
Mr. Dawkins: And then it's quite possible that we have some inspectors out
there who was collecting on the spot, huh? All right, no problem, no problem.
Mayor Suarez: Yes, I was going to say, when we gave them the C.O., didn't we
at that point check to see if this particular location was on line to be
charged for collection? Solid Waste collection.
Mr. Garcia: At this time we're doing that with the Building and Zoning
Department. They are advising us of any new businesses.
Mayor Suarez: Thank you, that's what I was hoping you'd say.
Mr. Garcia: Back then, I don't think it was being done.
Mr. Dawkins: What - 'I'm sorry, thanks Mr. ° Carlos. Joe, where are we on
collecting - I mean, where are we with the Bayside contract? Mr. Manager.'
Mr. Ingraham: We are approximately a week away with the Law Department from
'
completing the actual document. We have the equipment, the training's been
done to the drivers, this is a matter of having the legal document prepared
now and finalized, so that we can negotiate the contract.' And I hope.,.'
Mr. Dawkins: What's the hold up?
Mr. Ingraham: It's the matter of getting the contract out of the Law
`
Department this week.
Mr. Dawkins: The. Law Department say the contracts ready, it's nobody
negotiating it. Now you tell 'me you can't negotiate it because the 'Law
Department hasn't given it to you. Now where are we? OK, thank you, what is
correct, darling?
'-
Mrs, Dougherty; Both has to occur. The writing of the contract will take no
N
time at all, it's a matter of negotiating it, And both has to occur at this
time,
Mr. Dawkins; You know, you see, here again, we look, and I mean the
Commissioners see now, we go raise hell, buy equipment in a rush togota
r,
contract, Ba side stands b waiting for us to come Y Y give us the con... and we
still dilly dallying about the semantics of $ contract,
rp
r
' Mr, Ingraham; Mr. Commispioner, I can assure you that what we are attempting
<�
to do will be done as expeditioUPly as possible, As late as last ni$-ht.I
e
52 September 1, 1907
7
mow
iar'km 61 the proj eett We have son tat for elmitta tie earroatts wit I hope to
have it ty rriety from tho Law Depert'lbetta
Mrs Wet 'Mtn► about it we have it ready for signature v&xt meekl
Mr. Ingrahami Thetie whet we're Shooting 'for, sir. Imattly.
ter. OdLGI All right
Mr. Ingraham. 'That's exactly what valre shooting for.
Mr. Odio. Nett week Weill sign. Ia the equipment here?
Mr. Ingraham! The equipment is Was My folk have been trained. We're reedy
to go, it's gust a matter of getting that .lone.
Mr. bdiot Why don't you talk to Ruder and aee if we can arrange to start
moving in there on a gradual basis together with the other people and Mien
take a...
Mr. Dawkins: It's no better place to train then then get permission to go in
there as trainees and start picking up some of it, I don't know.
Mr. Ingraham, Yea, sir, we'll look into that.
Mr. Dawkins: And don't forget now, Mr. Manager, I also told him - that's a
big expensive piece of equipment. Anybody promoted and I'll say this to the
union and I will say it to anybody else. Anybody promoted to that equipment
should get it on merit, on a safe track record,; safe driving record, safe
attendance record and somebody who is kind and courteous who know how to talk
to people, OK?
Mr. Ingraham: I assure you, sir, that those plus...
Mr. Dawkins: I know, I've said that to you, but I want the Manager to-
=
understand, see?
Mr. Ingraham: Thank you.
Mr. Dawkins: Because we don't - I mean - the union is upset 'about it, so be
it. Because we're just not going to take anybody because he's been there 40
years, and thinks that he's entitled to it through longevity, that he should
get this new piece of equipment. He gets it if he's got a safe driving record
and what have you. - Now that's my feeling on it, Mr. Manager.
Mr. Odio: OK. Have you talked to the Hyatt also about using that equipment?
Mr. Ingraham: Yes, we've talked to certain members of the Hotel Association,
and as soon as we go on line with this one, we'll be prepared then to
negotiate the rest.
Mr. Odio: Well, this one we own, so...
Mr. Ingraham: Yes, sir.
Mr. Dawkins: That's all, thank you Mr. Manager. Now, the Manager's budget.
x
How much you got for travel?
Mr. Odio: Too much. Too much, Commissioner. I'm paying, you for your':.
and...
Mr. Dawkins: OK, all right. OTC, no problem. I don't have anything else.
Mr. Manager... Mr. Mayor..,
Mr,_ Odio: I guess we don't... no, he ` left, he told me that as ' f ar as he's
K
concerned, he 'won't have any more questions from the departments so.we don't
have to reconvene next Thursday. How about your Commissioner, you...
Mr. Dawkins: NQ, I mean, everyone's been coming to my office who I have
problems with, MrP Manager,
.,
Mar.' Odio No need to meet on Thursday then?
:
s
59 Septea�ker,. i `, 1967