HomeMy WebLinkAboutCC 1988-09-07 MinutesOF
OF NEETIM NEW 0 ER 7. 9se
(BUD= VORK P)
NP&M sr tm OFFICE OF THE CITY UM
CITY 11Au,
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1211121
MIMVTES OF REGVLAR NESTING
CITT COMMISSION OF MIAMI, FLORIDA
SEPTENSSR 7, lose
ITEM
•VSiECT
LEGISLATION
PAGE
MO.
NO.
..r
I.
PRESENTATION BY THE POLICE DEPARTMENT.
DISCUSSION
1-I5
(SEE LABEL 3)
9/7/88
1.
PRESENTATION BY PARKS AND
DISCUSSION
16-38
RECREATION DEPARTMENT.
9/7/88
3.
POLICE DEPARIIIENT PRESENTATION. (See
DISCUSSION
38-39
label 1)
9/7/68
•.
PRESENTATION. CABLES/COMPUTERS
DISCUSSION
39-40
DMIARTMENT.
9/7/88
S.
PRESENTATION BY PURCHASING DEPARTMENT.
DISCUSSION
40-41
9/7/68
6.
A - DISCUSSION CONCERNING POLICE
DISCUSSION
41-42
GUARDS; B - DISCUSSION CONCERNING
9/7/68
REVENUE FROM SCHOOL BOARD FOR USE OF
CITY PARKS.
7.
LAW DEPARTMENT PRESENTATION.
DISCUSSION
42-43
9/7/88
8.
(A) PRESENTATION BY COMFERZNCES AND
DISCUSSION
44-47
CONVENTIONS DEPARTMENT (B) DISCUSSION
9/7/88
OF COCONUT GROVE EXHIBITION CENTER
RENOVATION.
6•
COWOWS ON VACANCIES i ARTHUR BROOKS
DISCUSSION
47-48
LAYOFF.
9/7/88
10.
A - PRESENTATION BY INTERNAL AUDITS 4
DISCUSSION
48-51
REVIEWS. B - BRIEF COMMENTS ON BUDGET
9/7/88
DEPARTMENT, OFFICE OF TIM CITY MANAGER,
CITY CLERK AND BOARD OF COIMISSIOMRS.
11.
DISCUSSION ON SPORTS AUTHORITY BUDGET.
DISCUSSION
51-52
9/7/88
12. DISCUSSION ON INTERNATIONAL
TRADE DISCUSSION
82
BUDGET.
9/7/a8
�F.
DIiCUSSIpt ON pJBGIRT RESUCTIgIS
0! TttE DIBCpSSIpI
� Sl•�
MOM POLICE S'UMATION.
:.a
r
nt
OF
CITY OF MIAMI
DVDM YOR1tSHOP
September 7, 1996
h.ACE: Convantien Cuter
Riverfront South Hall
Apo S.%. ! Avenue
Miami, Florida
IN SESSION: 0100 A.M.
PRESENT: Commissioner Miller J. Dawkins
Commissioner Victor be Turre
City Attorney Jorge F. Fernandes
City Clark, Natty Hirst
ASSENT: Commissioner J. L. Plumsiar, Jr.
Vice Mayor Rosario Kennedy
Mayor Xavier L. Suarez
1. PRSSENTATION DT THR POLICE DEPARZt4ENT. (SEE LABEL 3)
Mr. Dawkins: OK, now what are we supposed to be explaining?
Mr. De Turre: I don't know, but they got some reinforcement this morning.
Mr. Dawkins: That's what I an trying to find out, you know, so I know ghat to
listen for.
Mr. De Turre: Ve're surrounded.
Mr. Surana: We'll try to explain that we have used approximately $3,000,000
of salary savings of funds in Police Departmen' budget.
Mr. Dawkins: You have used? Now could you have... I swan, I aw asking for
Information. Nov could you have used $3,000,000 of a budget that is not
approved?
Mr. Odio: Let we explain, Commissioner.
Mr. Dawkins: Do something! If its wrong.
Mr. Odio: In the past, what happened is we calculated the attrition and we
calculated the number of police officers that we will have at the end of the
year, and we projected a savings at the end of the year of $3,000,000. Vhat
we did, instead of adding it to the budget as was done in the past, we
subtracted. Now, the normal procedure three years ago would have been to may,
I
OK, the police budget Is $75,000,000. Ve will have a $78,000,000 budget and
at the end of the year, we have a surplus of $3.000,000, therefore, we were
heroes. Vhat we are saying now is, we do not take the savings at the end, we
are taking them up front. We deduct any savings we think we will have in any
department up front so that we don't have an inflated budget. to that's what
I said yesterday and I guess we were not clear about that. We were taking the
y
savings up front, that you cannot take savings twice. That we feel that we
�hF
have calculated the savings close enough, including civilian opployess, that
to deduct any more savings would be going to such. Ve are doing this &Iae,
t<f,
Commissioner, because when we sit down with Coopers and Lybrand erary you#
they have domandod for years that the City should not end up with • bW t+ t
x.
balance, that it should be controlled and that the savings should bd taup''up
front and not after the fact.
Mr. be Turre: 1,014 police officers appear on the "at for `N•'i�."4�� 4 :r
Mr. Surano: Tao, sir.
Mr. Do Turret to this number a factual number, or is it an incorrect number?
And if it is incorrect, why MM it put there?
Mr. Bursas: The target of the Police Department to achieve - 1,150 sworn
positioss at the and of fiscal year and that will depend on attrition* and
that will depend on when they put classes..
Mr. Odio: Has*, if I may odd, there is something that has coma up and I guess
I forgot yesterday, and last eight I was thinking about the luau*, that we
just signed an agreement with the TOT. In that agreement, we just gave the
police officers what they call a 20 year longevity. That means that officers
that would normally retire coming January would wait around another year so
they can get another five percent of their salary increase, therefore their
pension goes up, so we feel that the attrition rate will go much lower next
year than they have ever been before, because of this reason, and that is what
we calculated. The attrition was less and we war* going to try to increase
the number of police officers hired. Under the worst circumstances, I still
feel we tea hire 1,098 police officers, and the goal was 1,114 under the worst
circumatekaces, but if we didn't have the attrition expected, the target was
1.130.
Mr. be Turret Go ahead and answer the question.
Mr. Buren&: The budget we had proposed, that's based.
Mr. De Turre: No, the 1,114...
Mr. Surana: Tea, air.
Mr. De Turret ... how do you come up with 1,114?
Mr. Surana: 1,114 is partially funded, not fully funded.
Mr. De Turret If you add 1,114 police officers as you say here, do you have
the money to pay for them?
Mr. Surana: OK, 1,114 in that division, yes sir, on partially funded.
Mr. D* Turre: Do we have the money, or don't we have the money?
Mr. Surana: Tea, sir, we have money based on classes, based on attrition.
Mr. Do Turret OK, wall, explain to me about attrition. We're going to be
here all morning. We're going to get down to the bottom of this, one way or
another. Let's go back to yesterday, OK?
Mr. Surana: OK.
Mr. De Turret Let's go back to yesterday. Chief Anderson said we have 1,031
Police officers. Attrition, somewhere between five and six a month.
Mr. Bursa&: yes.
Mr. De Turre: That amounts to 72 a year, OK? We have academies that will
generate during the year approximately 70 officers, OK?
Chief Anderson: No, we are Basing more than that.
Mr. Surana: 60.
Chief Anderson:
Right.
Mr. be Turret
Well...
-
Mr. Odle: That
is where we made a mistake.
We are sot going to have 70.
Chief Anderson:
Let ma came back and...
Mr. be Turret
Now, 70 was the figure that
you said yesterday. tf there
change, then fine.
d „µ
Chief Asd*rsone
i km w, and...
_
g
Mr. Do Turret If them is a Change in that, we can get into that right ear
and find out what the story is.
Mr. Odie: lea, that's sot what want into the projection when the budget was
Prepared.
Chief Andersont btectly. The projection is that we are doing to have
somewhere in between this September and next September which would be the and
of the fiscal year, an attrition rate of one to six people a month, which
would indicate approximately 71 people through an attrition rate. but, we are
also saying at the same time with one, two, three, four, five scheduled
classes, that out of those classes, we should be able to hire at least 140
people. Out of...
Mr. Do Turret Jesus, we doubled up over nightl
Chief Andersont No, didn't double up over night. My information was
somewhat...
Mr. Do Turret What has traditionally been on an annual basis, the cumber of
police officers that graduate from the academy?
Chief Anderson: Wall, it depends upon their...
Mr. De Turret An average!
Chief Anderson: Well, we are... 80 and 100 officers, we are talking around.
Mr. De Turret OK, you are saying 90. Is that a fair smo=t, 90 a year? Tell
ate where there is going to be a difference between what has been and what is
going to happen this coming year.
Chief Anderson: Well, we feel that with 80 and 90 we are talking about the
last two classes with an attrition rate of five or six out of those classes,
providing the additional 40 people that we are talking... SO people.
Mr. De Turret Now many people go to a class, 277
Chief Anderson: No, we are talking about 28, anywhere from sometimes 28 to 30
people in a class.
Mr. Do Turre: Say 30 people.
Chief Anderson: OK, yes.
Mr. Do Turre: OK, you got a 30. Now, how many of those percentage wise, we
are talking about that 70, 80 percent graduate?
Chief Anderson: Wall, we are talking about even more than that now. Florida
Memorial has been involved in giving some pre -class learning, and we have had
a phenomenal success rate as a result of that. That's pre -class learning on
how to study, etc., and we've had some...
Mr. De Turre: When have you implemented that program?
Chief Anderson: I didn't understand.
Mr. De Turre: When was it Implemented?
Chief Anderson: I think we have been into that program now for about a year
and one-half.
Mr. be Turret
Last year, how many students, how many
cadets did you boot in
the academy and
bow may graduated?
Chief Aadersost
We bad a very low dropout rate, but
how awry people did we
,
have graduate
last year? We would have to get the
figures for you, butjust
}
r
Mr. De Turret
It should be readily availsbli, bow many gr"ustod
Now weary went Into
the academy and bow many gradustedt
Chief Anderson: What we are going to hove this year too is, we did not have
-- *ram ghat I understand, frequent tc..ing. 't., :hat ire are
going to do this year, which would avail us to more potential recruits and
candidates, frequent monthly testing, which would allow us more of a resouree
pool to chose from, oo this year we believe that we will be able to realize
our goal of a realization of at least 1,100 officers that we are talking
about, up to September 6th. That's what we are looking at right now, because
sow with the rapid testing, monthly testing, we should be able to realize that
goal. before, it was infrequent testing by Human Resources, so we are going
to see that beefed up more this year. What we are going to do, Commissioner,
even though we may give you a figure for last year, what we are saying is that
we are going to accelerate and we are going to increase the hiring process.
Mr. be Turret Teo, but what I want to know right now is based on this on pro -
step where you are trying to teach them so they can learn better before then
go in, which was implemented a year and one-half ago, which means that for the
fiscal year it has been fully enforced. I want to know what kind of impact it
has? Now many graduated at the class that I spoke at the other day?
Chief Anderson: Wall, he's indicating the lost class. The class that you
spoke at I think was the class before that, but we only lost, I think in the
last class, one recruit, one candidate.
Mr. De Turret Now many were there in that class?
Chief Anderson: Twenty-six. Twenty, how many? Twenty-two in that class.
Mr. De Turret Twenty-two.
Chief Anderson: We also believe that we determine our own fate too. If we
work at it honestly, under my direction we believe that we can reach our
targeted goal by the end of this year, of at least the 1,100 figure.
Mr. Dawkins: Mr. Manager, have someone from Personnel get for Commissioner Do
Turre and I the total number of individuals put into the criminal institute,
the total number who graduated, and the total number, who are still on the
Miami Police Department from the classes last year.
Mr. Odio: OK.
Mr. Dawkins: And when they bring that back we will go into the, Commissioner.
Mr. De Turret Teo, these are things you should have readily available, guys.
I mean, like you should know how many came onto the force last year.
Chief Anderson: I agree with you. Previously we probably should have done a
lot of things that we didn't.
Mr. Dawkins: She can use the phone in the...
Chief Anderson: I can guarantee you that next budget hearing... that I an not
making any excuses for what occurred previous to me, but I can guarantee you
that all of these figures will be available in the future, at the next budget
hearing with...
Mr. De Turret OK, let's proceed now then, so that we can save some time.
Would 22, that last class, be a representative class of the whole year?
Chief Anderson: Tea.
Mr. Do Turret OK, so...
Chief Anderson: No, I ON not going to say that because what you are trying
to, and I understand your direction, whore you are going. Vhat you u�
saying...
Mr. Do Turret Oh, you know exactly where I an heading. >
Chief Anderson: Sure I do, but what you are saying is that a clogs 418,e of
22, would that represont an average sited class? - and what we are tilling you
is it is dependent upon the emphasis that w place on the number to go into
4«
' b y,
J� 4
ems_ .1Stssi:'
Class, and that is
what we are telling you,
so I don't think it
would be fair
and accurate to use
22 or 21 or any figure in
between, and we or*
tolling you
t`._: .. �_:;_:t .!.-:
=: are going to be able
to put a number of
classes with a
number of recruits
into the academy within
between September
and the next
September, so that's
what we are indicating
and telling you, so there isn't
any way that...
Mr. Do Turre: Projections, projections have to be based on something, so tell
an what your basing the projection on?
Chief Anderson: Wall, we could go back to, an earlier period, I am basing my
projection on the kind of emphasis that I am going to place on background.
I'm projecting, basing my projection on the number of people that probably
will be provided through testing, and I we basing my projection on the
resource pool, so that's what I se looking at, and that is what I am saying
that I sm going to be able to produce at the end of the year.
Mr. be Turr*: Lot me ask you, when you selected the candidates to go into the
academy, are you limited per number, or is it as many as come on that qualify
that you put them into the academy for that quarter? Nov does that work?
Chief Anderson: Well, we are not limited for number. We are limited as far
as our manpower might be in ralation to doing background and some other
things, but that's something that we control. We control that. That means
that if I could increase the number of background investigators, or we improve
In the area of background, it should be...
Mr. Odio: Perry, let me help you out on this, because as you remember, at
the meetings that we had with the task force that was created two and one-half
years ago, that you war* a part of, we decided then that we were going to slow
down recruitment, and we were going to slow down recruitment for this past
year, until still we war* satisfied that the procedures we had in place were
satisfactory, to &sour* us that the quality of recruits what we wer* looking
for, so that we would be assured that these people would be good police
officers in the future, and we did slow down on purpose. Fact is, at one ties
we screened... it took 2,000 people, I remember, to got ten candidates. Was
that correct?
Chief Anderson: Yes.
Mr. Odio: We also had to put in place the new psychological testing, that we
did this past year, and I could go on and on, I think I can explain.
Chief Anderson: What we did, we revisited the whole process, to make sure.
Mr. Odio: Absolutely, we revamped the whole process of rocruitment
Chief Anderson: Yes, because of our experiences that we have had.
Mr. Odio: I held up two classes, to my knowledge, and I could be corrected on
that I held up two classes, that I wanted to make sure that we had
the proper procedures of hiring in place.
Chief Anderson: You delayed that class, so... yes.
Mr. Odio: I did, I remember it, and then we went back and we did - put in
Place. when we had in place the new procedures, we opened up again the
recruitment, and now we feel that is in place. And this is the time now to go
out and actively recruit police officers under the testing that we now have in
Place. I guess we all forget, because it's been a long ties going through all
of this, but that is what really happened. OK, so this year is not on
accurst* year to compare it.
Mr. Do Turret We're talking about, let's say that you hart 30 per class. Is
that a fair amount?
Chief Anderson: Yell... t
Mr. De Turret We haw* to agree on noise number here, guys, you kasw.
Chief Anderson: Well, you are asking us OW Whet...
Mr. be Turret If sot, if we ean't agree on something, then I have to go on
history.
Chief Anderson: OK, let's agree on this, OK? Let's &arse on ghat I aw
providing you with, all right?... the figure of 28, and I'll give you the
figures and let's ears# on those figures, if we have to ear** on something.
Aare* on what I'm giving you as a projected figure that we are going to put in
class.
Mr. Do Turret OK, 28 out of which what, 10 percent don't graduate? So that
Is out of 28, three don't graduate. You are talking about 25 par class,
right?
INAUDIBLE SACKGROUND COMMENTS NOT ENTERED INTO THE PUBLIC RECORD.
Mr. De Turret OK, so we ore in agreement with that. The class** are going to
have 25 graduating.
Chief Anderson: but see, I am not going to sit here... I think realistically,
I think you ere in the business world and you understand this, all right. If
you ere asking me on the and of the year, that we are going to be ten people
different from a 1,000 or 1,100, and I sm not going to sit up here and try to
justify that I em going to be ton officers different at the end of the year.
Mr. De Turre: No, no, I got no problem with that. I just, so I can
understand, you know, we can understand each other and the concept and how
such money do you actually need for these additional police officers.
Chief Anderson: We need monies to budget 1,100 officers, and that is what we
or* looking at.
Mr. Do Turret Well, we have to justify it, and that's what I m asking you to
do, you know, and it all boils down to numbers, and I know that you are not a
numbers man, you know, you are a police officer and that's your job and that's
why you got...
Chief Anderson: Oh, I know how to balance my check.
Mr. Do Yurr*: What's that?
Mr. Odio: Give his the breakdown you have there, stop by stop, to reach the
number of $48,000,000 that you need.
NOTE FOR THE RECORD: Commissioner Plummer entered the meeting at
9:17 a.m.
Chief Anderson: This is what we have, C- issioner. September, we are
looking at an attrition rate of approximately five people. We are thinking
about looking at hiring a class of approximately 27 to 28 people. Looking at
the attrition rat* in between that, we are also looking at January, hiring
another class, or putting another class in the academy, with an attrition rate
again based upon the same thing. Now, we are talking about & monthly
attrition rate, anywhere from five to six people in between those areas. What
I've given you is the period of time that we saying that we are going to hire.
In January, we are talking about a class of 28 people. In March we are
looking at a class of 28 people, and it could be more, it could be somewhat
less. You know, I m saying that within that range, that is what wo are
looking at. We are also looking at June, hiring a class of approxisstoly 2S
to 30 people, same ratio, with the same attrition rate. We are looking at
going all the way up to the end of the fiscal year of September, and hiring
approximately anywhere from 28 to 30 people.
Mr. De Turret Hell, that is the class, that would start in September. {g,
Out that is for the other fiscal year coming up.
Chief Anderson: No, that is still in this same fiscal year if you look at t,
budget period.
Mr. be Turret NO, no, it is just like this one. We are starting this qns
September now. ,
Mr. Dawklse: Mr. Manager, when we left hers yesterday, in my opinion, I seen,
!t I as %:_ _ag, ..L :..3, _... _.: s:e, the discussion was that there was
$2.000,000 or $3,000,000 Commissioner?
Mr. De Turret $2,000,000.
Mr. Dawkins: There was $2,000,000 surplus in the police budget. Now, is that
a fact, and if it is, why?... and it it is not. Now, you opened up the
discussion by saying that you projected $2,000,000 worth of savings...
Mr. Odio: Three, three.
Mr. Dawkins: ... that you took up front as a saving. Nov, the thing that has
me puzzled and this rhetoric is just confusing me more is, if there is no
savings, as the Commissioner says, there is no $2,000,000. If there is a
savings, where is the $2,000,0007 And if it is a contingency fund, or
whatever it is, explain that to the Commissioner and if it is not, tell his we
will reduce the budget by $2.000,000. I mean, but everybody keeps going
around the issue of what the Commissioner sake. Is there $2,000,000, or is
there sot?
Mr. Odio: There is not.
Mr. Dawkins: Well then, tell him whyl
Mr. Odio: The reason why is that we took the savings up front.
Mr. Dawkins: Nov can you take savings up front? That 'a the part that is
confusing us.
Mr. Odio: We made a projection for the whole year. We calculated what we
felt was conservative, of $3,000,000 savings in the department and reduce the
budget by $3,000.000. Ye anticipated the savings.
Mr. Plummer: It's a... piece of paper in front of you.
Mr. Odio: A budget is a piece of paper.
Mr. Dawkins: That's the problesl
Mr. De Turret Teo, but you know what the bottom line is? The Chief says that
he needs a budget for 1,100 police officers.
Mr. Odio: Maybe what I should hava done, Commissioner...
Mr. De Turre: And the money is not thera because they took it up front.
According to that theory...
Mr. Odio: No, what I should have done...
Mr. Plummer: It is strictly terminology, that's all it is.
Mr. Odio: What I should have done is bring a budget...
Mr. De Turre: Wall, taxpayers don't understand that kind of terminology.
Mr. Odio: bring a budget for $78,000,000 and cut it here by $3,000,000.
Mr. Plummer: Look, in the old days they called it anticipated salary **visa*.
There is one that was here in the old days. It's a paper transaction. I keep
saying, and I will continue to say, a budget is nothing more than projectigm
It is a guesstimate. You dealt know today what is going to happen the #*a
the year. Look what happoned to us last year. Ve mods a promise to the pwse
that we would have the Police Dspartmest to 1,100 by the end of this fiscal sa
year. Nobody know that we ware going to have a disaster called the River Cabe
and lose damn sear 70 policemen. Nov, you try to ovorooms 70 peliaemem >lA' M y>
lump, then the natural attrition of another 70, and you just sas't make any
kind of a projection on that kind of a situation. You have to put the WXMW! 1
is the budget, it is case you are successful in doing overyttAng y" "at, Ii f
you are not successful, that meney is not mood. Is our particular sea
$1,000,000 of that anticipated ssviags west for ovsrtbw. Mawr, WWra dl# 41p.¢
-41
v k
ether Bonito so is what you'll have to justify, OK? but as far as I Be
concerned, this is a guesstimate. I've always said it is a funny book. It is
funny because it is •-t f- V.
..'I. ,r *actual. A budget cannot be
factual, it is has got to change at all times, that's why you have throe
eolumns: projected, expended, and than as modified. That's why you got three
columns in every one of your budgets.
Mr. Dawkins: Well, all we are trying to say up here is, and you put it
beautifully, but the administration hasn't said it. You said...
Mr. Plummer: Mall, they don't get paid to be beautiful.
Mr. Dawkins: beg pardon?
Mr. Plummer: They don't got paid to be beautiful, they are all uglyl
Mr. Odio: Wall, Commissioner...
Mr. Dawkins: OK, but no...
Mr. Plummer: Including the guy from Coconut Grove.
Mr. Dawkins: ... as J.L. said, you not only had the River Case, you had the
police murder where you had an abundance of overtime. Tom see, you guys got
the information here, you are just not telling us, and the reason that you
went in the hole is because you had the River Case. You had the policeman
murder, so you paid overtime for guys trying to catch him. Than you also had
policemen who were suspended and couldn't work. You had to pay overtime for
guys to cover the jobs that they were on, and you had a reserve that you used
and some kind of way. I mean, I'■ not a budget Ban, so you had a
$3,000.000... call it anything you want, contingency fund, but you took
$3,000,000 and you stuck it in the salary someplace so you could have a
contingency fund. Explain that to the Commissioner so he can tell the voters
when they ask him what the hell happened to the $2,000,000.
Mr. Odio: I think you did it very well just now.
Mr. Do Yurre: Well, that was this year, we are talking about next year.
Mr. Dawkins: Next year.
Mr. Odio: Next year...
Mr. Dawkins: They are trying to provide.
Mr. Odio: ... the Police Department came in with a budget of $79,000,000. As
we reviewed the budget, we decided that there would be savings at the and of
the year, close to $3,000,000. We removed the $3,000.000 from the budget, and
have a budget of $75,000,000, and what you are saying, Commissioner, is that
you want to reduce another $2,000,000, and I as saying to that, no wayl There
Is no way that we can reduce another $2,000,000 and have the department...
Mr. De Turre: You say say no way, but you have yet to prove to so why you
can't reduce it $2,000,000.
Mr. Odio: The projection is... because we are projecting that at least we
would have 1,100 police officers at the end of the year, and the Bonier are
needed to fund those officers.
Mr.
Do Yurr*:
OK, now...
Mr.
Odio: On
top of that, Commissioner Plummer yesterday requested, am we
X
war* not eve•
counting
on this, that we add another S9 PSA's, to a total of
"-
100,
and that
money has
to cows frog somewhers . That wasn't awes f i=vred to
this. I dos't
*van have
the money in this budget for that.
Mr.
be Turret
Now, we
or* going back to the 1,100 Polito officers, mW
m k.
x ;y
You
say 19100,
it could
be 1,114 that we are looping in the boobs.
Mr.
Odin: If
we wake 1,114,
,
I'd be wo ha
ry hap". Me watt to wale*
y„
xr
JV
y,
5
yr
Mr. De Turre: Nov, does the SSO, » 9,476 that we see here for personnel
services, is that reflective of the 1,114 police officers?
Mr. Nano Surana: Teo air.
Mr. be Turre: to than the son*y exists, OK? So, you haven't taken anything
up front or behind or any other way. The money is there. That is part of the
budget.
Mr. Surana: Tom, that money exists, funding based on attrition, not full
funding. Ye are not fully funded, 1,114 positions. Those positions...
Mr. Do Turre: Then it's not reflective of 1,114 police officers.
Mr. Odio: You do it according to attrition and hiring*... you don't take
1.114 times...
Mr. De Turre: No, I m not talking 1,114 from day one, of twelve months. I
understand that, OK?
Mr. Odio: That is right, so yes, we are shooting for... we or* saying that at
the end of the fiscal year, we want to have 1,114 officers. That doesn't mean
that we are taking 1,114 officers times $60.000, or whatever it might be and
because that is what you'd be talking about $60,000,000. The cost of a police
officer is $59,000. You take 1,114 officers times $59,000, that would be
almost $60,000,000, and we are saying we are budgeting them for fifty. That
Is why you era taking a chance...
Mr. De Turre: Right. OK, but the bottom line is, so we can agree on
something, that this budget has the money for 1,114 police officers at the end
of the year. Are we in agreement with that?
Chief Anderson: Yes.
Mr. De Turre: OK, now based on what tame Chief has just been telling us, 25
per class, that is 100 graduating.
Chief Anderson: No, I didn't tell you that. I said that the classes - go on,
go on- to at I don't... maybe this is somewhat difficult, I as not a figures
guy, but...
Mr. Plummer: You will be by next year.
Chief Anderson: Yes, of course I will be. In Coconut Grove, we learn how to
count. but, I can understand very simply that we are not going to realise
today 1,100 officers.
Mr. De Turre: No, I am talking about this time next year.
Chief Anderson: That means today, but OK, what we are saying In that you have
to believe in what I am saying to you is that at the and of the year, right,
that we are going to realize 1,100. In between that, there is some projected
savings, right? That means that if we start off today with a budget of
$78,000,000, which seems to very... that we wouldn't have 1,100 officers, so
there is no justification for a budget of $78,000,000 at this particular time.
to projected... well, I'm just playing it, you know, I am trying to do a
mathematical thing here, realising that some of his other qualities he is a
CPA.
Mr. Do Turre: I never studied for the exam. I got an accounting degree,
though.
Chief Anderson: OK, wall, the point that I as saying is that in between that
period, that is a realisation of savings, right? but, since we cannot "big"
the figure of 1,100 today, and the projection is on toptesmber, withia 'pY is
the fiscal year, that we are going to have that money budgeted inert mentally
until we get to the period of the realisation from what I understand, of 1,100officers. Now, bow that, the *mechanics of that, of Met you and tslitt"
about, in between that, right? You are saying well, we bne had sow 161408"
as high as ig people in the clams. We have hod sons Classes 40<;0
people in the class, so the mcbanics and the variation to M04" uom
somewhat debatable of how we are going to go. Yt may bsve sow dJ im
ten people, but it doesn't mean the bast time that we are not going to have a
class of 36 or 40 people.
Mr. be Turre: but the average is 28, with a 10 percent failing.
Chief Anderson: Well, what I am saying, that was the average because of sou*
reasons that occurred, right? I think the Commissioner eloquently...
Mr. Odio: put, lets say this, Perry, that...
Mr. De Turre: Well, we have to base it on something, you know.
Mr. Odio: Well, this is how we meant, suppose that we are saying that you are
going to have an attrition rate of five a month, five or six, five or six.
Suppose we don't have those people leaving, than you adjust your class to what
we are trying to do.
Chief Anderson: We just said that because of the 20 year longevity right,
some of those people may frees*, they may not move, and that is what we are
looking at, they may, you know, we are talking about maybe 30 people, a
guesstimate of 30 people, but they may not leave now because they have a
longevity of 20 years, five percent more money.
Mr. Do Turre: I've got you. Now, you have got to get me too, and my point is
that 100 officers that graduate out of the academy...
Chief Anderson: What I am telling you, right? - is that, let me repast this
one more time, is that if we need 140 officers on the end to make 1,100,
right?... of which I am stating that I need to do whatever needs to be done
operationally, or whatever, right? That whatever is need to do that, that is
what we are going to realise on the and. OK, that, the ability to do that,
rests with me.
Mr. Plummer: No, that is not entirely true.
Chief Anderson: That's true, Mr. Commissioner, I agree. I know I... back and
forth.
Mr. Plummer: Teo. Let me tell you one of the reasons it is not entirely
true. One of the biggest problems we had is getting these people qualified to
get them into the academy, which is not your basic. That is Personnel. If
you will recall, about four years ago, when we tried to make this big,
tremendous push, Personnel could not crank them out fast enough to get them
Into the academy, so before you ever get them for background checks, you have
got to have Personnel cranked up to where they can in fact, do what is
necessary.
Mr. Odic: Commissioner, you were not her*, I think. One thing that happened
this past year, and that is why you can't compare, is that we completely
changed the way we were hiring police officers, from testing to psychological
battery tests, to the review... an I correct Warshaw? - do you want to soy it
on the record, how we changed it, and now we are in place, and now I was
talking to Rene Larrieu yesterday. He fools that he can crank them up fast
enough, knowing what the rules are. We did not know, in the past year and
one-half, exactly where were going on this. Now, we do know, right? Do you
want to say how many you feel you can...
Mr. Plummer: Would somebody while that man is coming up, I've got to jump on
you in on* area. Chief, so be prepared -I.D. bureau. I need your... go ahead.
Chief Anderson: OK, what do I need to be prepared for?
Mr. Plummer: No, no, go ahead and let him follow through.
Chief Anderson: OK, all right.
Mr. Reno Larrieu: Rene Larrieu, Department of Personnel Maasg"out. In
reference to the question that has been addressed, the answer is as follow,
The Department of Personnel Management, in order to achieve the goal of 1,100
presently is Cranking up a master recruitment program for poll$* offlooro
starting next week. In other words, we are going to be recruitima hpteoftr,
October, tasting to November. We are going to genarate sbmt 1,00
10 _
applicants, of which we anticipate to have in the register anywhere from 600
to 700, come December of this year, eo the Chief is going to have a brand new
_:gist+r in December of '88, with 600 to 700 names corer January.
Mr. Plummer: Teo, but let me caution you there. Tou cause us, the Commission
a lot of grief, and I don't know how to avoid it, but you ought to find a way.
You have, let's may, just pulling numbers out of the air, 600 of a register,
which are capable of being put in the school. You only take 30, OK?... that
to five percent. The other 95 percent are held in abeyance, not knowing when,
how, they might or might not be put into school. It is impossible for them to
go out and got a job, and say to their employer, I'm working for you, and I'll
only work for you until they call me to go to the police academy. Most of
them can't even gat a job. Now, that's where I think this PSA program is going
to be a blessing. If you gat that up to 100, hopefully those PSA's are the
ones that you can draw on who are making a salary, who immediately can go to
the academy. Vhen you put those PSA's on line, if you don't put than as a
bullpen waiting to go to the academy, you've made a hell of a mistake. But,
we in our offices get calls day in and day out. "I an on the register to go
the academy. I can't get a job, because nobody will hire me knowing that I am
going to go to the police academy and that's where I want to go". So I an
saying to you, that you ought to have it in some kind of a sequence that a guy
knows that "Hay, if 1 an going it is not going to be in this academy, it is
going to be in the third class, the second class, or the fourth class" because
In my estimation that is only fair to the individual. If you take a guy and
you qualify him and say yes, you are qualified to go to the academy December
1, but you don't hire him into the academy until September of next year, he is
held in limbo and that is when our offices start getting calls and saying,
"what is going on.?"
Mr. Larrieu: I agree with you Commissioner, 100 percent. In the past we've
had that problem because of budget constraints. Sometimes we do have the
people in the register and we cannot process because of budget constraints,
but however, the realistic picture now is we are cranking up a massive
recruitment program to get the 700 people that we will have in the register
come December and come January we are going to go on a monthly recruitment
basis intermittent so that we are going to be testing all year around for
police officers so we can achieve that magic number of 1,100 come next time,
next year. Now, from the last two registers, the past statistics show that
for every... we are cranking up about 10 percent from what we have in the
register to what we hire, is about 10 percent. So in other words, if we give
then a 600 name register, we will hire 60 people from that list. All the rest
will be processed through the entire system, but in one process or the other
will be eliminated. So...
Mr. Plummer: Question.
Mr. Larrieu: Yes, sir.
Mr. Plummer: Can the academy... what is the maximm number the academy can
take at one time?
Mr. Larrieu: In one class?
Mr. Dawkins: Tea, from us.
Mr. Plummer: One class, two classes at one time? Can you simultaneously have
classes?
Mr. Larrieu: Forty.
Mr. Plummer: Forty. Can they have two classes going at the same time?
Mr. Larrieu: Yes, sir.
Mr. Plumper: Tien, there is your answer. If you get 600 hundred, you how the
Chief December let a qualified register with 600 names, why aren't you putting
80 or 120 in at that time?
Mr. Odio: Because of budgetary constraints.
Mr. Plummer: There is so budgetary constraints.
this coming year.
We are ant is ipat i4 that is
A'a=
11
Mr. Odio: No, sir.
Mr. Dawkiaat Well, how could you sap we are going to bring the force opt YOU
see, this is what is confusinal
Mr. Odio: because this is incremental, Commissioner. Let me...
Mr. Dawkins- Well, that is your thrae million savings that you ain't got.
Put it in...
Mr. Odiot If you take 1,100 officers and multiply then times the total cost
of one officer, then we are funding partially. We are funding what we feel
the projection will be.
Mr. Plummer: Cesar, you are going to lose.
Mr. Odiot Right.
Mr. Plummer: Now, what I ma mean when I me saying you are going to loss
knowing what we are anticipating, and where we are trying to got to, if he can
start a class of 80 in December. I may to you, in the balance of 12 months...
Mr. Odio: Well, what he is not saying because he is not a police officer,
Commissioner, and we went through this in meetings and hours and hours, you
bring in 60 brand new police officers to the force, and you got supervisional
problems, and I am not a police chief and you had better explain that one.
Mr. Plummert You got supervisional with 40 new men.
Mr. Odio: You have a problem when you bring in 80 brand now rookies into the
department at one time, Commissioner. You can't... Perry, you bettor talk.
Chief Anderson: I think the Commisaioner known, Commissioner Plummer knows,
because we...
Mr. Dawkins: I have to say, and I keep saying it, the question that we left
yesterday is, is there $2.000,000. "fat" in the budget, or is it not?
Mr. Odio: There is not.
Mr. Dawkins: Everybody that you had explained to the Commissioner that it is
notl
Chief Anderson: What I want to say to...
Mr. Dawkins: go you keep going around about numbers and people and all...
Mr. Odio: Commissioner, the answer is, I feel...
Mr. Dawkins: hlxplain it to his so that we can go to something else.
Mr. Odio: I as trying to say there is no $2,000,000 hiding in this police
budget.
Mr. Dawkins: Well explain it to him why it is not.
Mr. Odio: The budget, I have explained it to his, if he doesn't agree in our
projection, that it is his prerogative to do so. Now, be says we ars, going to
have 1,064, and therefore there is $2,000,000 sitting here somewbore, that.is
a projection that he is doing. We did another projection.
,x
_t.
Chief Anderson: The only thing that I Want to day that is *I",*
because red I hope than you don't look at us sad say we have $15,�Q�pp
you are of to '
going put us in dire straits, right? If you saying that gat ter.
rove $75,000,000, asd you are going to take away from that j75,000,000, #t
more million, then you are going to put us in a position where VS jogt 94a
function.
Mr. Dawkins: That is not what he is Saying, Chief. Whst he is MWLOS
you hove g73 000 040to
8
he is saying is that
I roman, i
the bwhgst
hate
has
to try to he
$75.000,000,
an
srbitroteP #o". IM
and
withlo "Olt
budgeted •X" to a am parer, police officers and that is funded for a ton
month period, but it is come up that instead of "X" to the unknown power, it
Is "X" to a known power and if you deduct the known from the unknown power,
you got one •X" and that one "X" equates out to $2,000,000 and whore is it and
bow did it come about? - that is all he is asking and we have yet to said it
and it you don't know how to say it, than we don't know, and let's go to
something else.
Mr. Odio: Wall, but we do kaowt We are saying that we do not have an
additional $2,000,000. We are paying that the projections made for personnel
costs are as accurate as we think they can be at the and of We could
have an incident and you don't even have enough money here to cover this, if
we have too such overtime like we had this past year.
Mr. Do Turret That is why we have a surplus fund.
Mr. Odiot The fund balance was depleted this past year.
Mr. Do Turret Now such do we have, $10,000,000?
Mr. Odio: We have now, probably and up, as Coopers and Lybrand I hope will
show, about $10,000.000 as of now. But at the ■iddle of the year, we had
zero, and going down, fast.
Mr. Do Turret The bottom line is, my numbers project, based on history and
based on everything that we have spoken about here, and it hasn't been proven
to as differently, that we are going to have about 1,065 officers next year,
that is it. I don't age any more, any loss, I really don't, and I look at
that and I look at the 1,114 that we have this $50,000,000 for, and there is a
fifty officer difference, and that 50 officer difference at $59,000 is
$3.000.000, so I as saying is, you can leave $1,000.000 there. I s• just
talking about $2,000,000 being cut out. That is what I as looking for and you
know, that's what I'll bring up at the public hearings and everything else and
you know, and if you guys feel that you prove to me differently again, you are
more than welcome to come sit down with me and try to dissuade me, OK?
Mr. Surana: OK, those 50 officers, we have funded only $300,000 only for
three months, the difference you are talking about.
Mr. De Turret That is the last three months, the last throe months of the
quarter.
Mr. Surana: Too. sir, not funded for whole year, only $300,000. That is the
maxis= we have surplus, if you don't fill those 50 officers.
Mr. Odlo: Who is going to pay for the PSA's?
Mr. Surans: Tos, I ae just saying, OK?
Mr. De Turret Well, that... I as not talking about PSA's.
Mr. Plummer: We can cancel the Law budget, we can take it out of there.
Mr. Odiot For the saxisum surplus, what he is saying is that after we
reviewed the budget last night, it is $336,000 to be exact, from removing the
50 officers.
Mr. Plussert Don't worry about it since we cancelled the Law budget, we will
just take it out of that. Lot me tell you what the bottom line is and Victor
the bottom line In we are forbidden by Charter to end the year in a deficit,
and if you don't have the monies and you don't project it and have sons kind
of either a fund balance or a carry-over, I = not going to sit here and take
the Mat for it. Are you finished? Chief, I got a problem. New giant' V0 10
do you have working in the ID bureau?
Mr. Odiot What is the ID bureau?
Mr. P1=seer: Ident if scat ion. They are the finger print 4u7g•
and sNss up your house worse than the burglar.
Mr. Odiot Too many.
ftey ap�rr
ti-
Chief Aaderses: I believe we do not have too many. Identification Supervisor
I, and we have ID Tech II's. luporvisore -? and ID Tech I's -20.
Mr. Plummer: That ie a total of how may in the luresu?
Chief Anderson: Zl.
Mr. Plummer: And how such money?
Chief Anderson: Whst is the bottom line figure in money? Do we have that? I
think that is indicated in that budget breakout, that one shoat.
Mr. Pl%sam r: Give we a ballpark figure, not to the dollar.
Chief Anderson: OK, we are talking about $1,300,000.
Mr. Plusser: $1,500,000?
Chief Anderson: Teo.
Mr. p1monwr: Chief, I want you to justify for me on the afternoon shift
yesterday you had a total for the entire City of one ID Tech. The backup of
calls yesterday went unbelievable. That was your afternoon shift, where the
dispatchers were begging, don't call for ID, have them call the following day.
I don't have to tell you that I am going to tell the Manager what that does in
the delay of calls. Why was there only one - one ID Tech for the entire City
yesterday in the afternoon shift?
Chief Anderson: For the afternoon shift we had five assigned to work
yesterday, and they ware working, but because of the police shootings and some
homicides, they have been working on, I think they had seven homicides that
they have been backed up, processing and taking care of evideatary work.
Mr. Plum r: Your dispatcher said you had one ID tech.
Chief Anderson: That is assigned to...
Mr. Plummer: On the otreotsl
Chief Anderson: Yes, on the street duty, but the problem is that processing
with the seven homicides, you know how long that requires for then to do that
work, that they are out of service and they are not available for service, so
that is the problem there. Actually working, there were five ID technicians
working yesterday.
Mr. Plummer: You are telling me that you pulled four off the street to put
them inside without going to overtime, is that what you are telling me?
Chief Anderson: What we are saying, no, yesterday we used both overtime and
to assist with street aaaignmenta.
Mr. Plummer: Are you still now holding a patrol car on the scene till ID
arrives?
Chief Anderson: No, no, it depends upon the kind of scene. If it is a
homicide, or a major crime...
Mr. Plummor: Of course.
Chief Anderson: ... then we will keep a car there, but if it is of a logger
crime, we do not keep the car there.
ra
Mr. Zlv�r: Yell, I'M just going to go in the record. You've got di people
In that department sad you caa only put one on the street, I'm Sol" to tell
you in my estimation, that's a major problem of vsansgsemsat of people, b11Q1gi",
bare again, as I said yesterday, we are serving the public *ad %Aoo
T+w toll
the public that you only got one ID Tech on the street, mW +fgl '}
tomorrow, but don't touch anything until he gets there, basically fIR�RA a y .
your house until that ID Tech can gat there tomorrow, I've got to t*li f s',
a citizen, I'm not happy with that.
A�
7 �3
Chief Asdereon: All right. I agree with you and I'm slowing chipping at
various areas and one of the things that I an going to do when I go back, I
._..'t set why we didn't have tAe suye. 1..., .,uL ..,t.a or why we didn't have
other people to respond.
Mr. Plummer: Pull his out of the office and put his on the street.
Chief Aadereon: I agree with you wholeheartedly.
Mr. Plumoor: PSA's. by the way, also did ID work in the past.
Chief Anderson: Teo, I agree.
Mr. Dawkins: Chief, I understand that you would like to have the Office of
Professional Compliance back in the Police Department, is that a fact?
Chief Anderson: Teo.
Mr. Dawkins: OK, Mr. Manager, I'd like to see the Office of Professional
Compliance put under the Chief for one year and let's evaluate it and sae
where it is. Think that can be worked out? Vho is in charge while he is on
the phone? No, I want you to make a decision, I don't need no note.
INAUDIBLE BACKGROUND COMMENTS NOT ENTERED INTO THE PUBLIC RECORD.
Mr. Dawkins: Why can't you, you are in charge! OK, all right then. OK, go
ahead to the next one.
Mr. Plummer: Are there any further questions of the Chief?
Mr. Dawkins: No.
Mr. Pluisser: Chief, do you got a comments you want to sake before you leave?
Chief Anderson: Other than I appreciate the support I've gotten from the
Commission and I understand the direction of the Commission, and I feel that
everything that you have done has been to enhance our responsibilities and
provide a service to the community and I feel that you have done that and I
feel very comfortable with you.
Mr. Plummer: May I strongly urge you that between now and the public hearing
on Friday night which is... is that our first public hearing Friday night, or
tomorrow night?
Mr. Surana: Friday night.
Mr. Plummer: Between now and S:OS on Friday night, that you make available
somebody in your department to sit down with Commissioner be Turre and go
through that as long as he wants, and hopefully it will shorten the time of
the public hearing. Cosmissionar De Turre, I've asked the Chief to sake
somebody available to you, at your convenience if you want to try to sit down
and go through this and through this and I as not saying sake you understand,
but hopefully come up with an idea of where you are and what is happening.
INAUDIBLE BACKGROUND COi4lMS NOT ENTERED INTO THE PUBLIC RECORD.
Mr. Plummer: OK, hey, I we saying if the Chief wants to cut the time down at
the public hearing, sake somebody available.
Chief Anderson: I will sake somebody available.
e's
Mr. Plummer: I just recommend that.
Chief Anderson: All right, thank you.
V
/s
`13=77"ATION ST PARKS AND RF-REATION DEPAR'1 ISNT.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mr. Pluwemert Commissioner De Turre has asked that the next setter be taken up
Is Parka and Recreation, correct? Parka and Recreation. According to my...
Nano, ghat page is... oh, here it In. Eighty-four, one sixteen, one nine...
all of that for Parks and Recreation?
Mr. Surens: That includes Orange Sovl, Miami Stadium...
Mr. Do Turret Now many millions? Let's cut back another two million right
Dow.
Mr. Plummer: That includes all of the Enterprise funds as well? I guess we
start with page 94. Too, 94. I guess go ahead.
Mr. Walter Colby: The proposed budget for Parks and Recreation, Public
facilities, Parka and Recreation Division is $645,000. $139,000, or six
percent more than the fiscal year '87-'88 budget. This increase is in
temporary services, property maintenance charges, a four percent increase in
salary expense and also $175,400 for Sayfront Park.
Mr. Dawkins: So what about Sayfront Park, Mr. ...
Mr. Golby: $175,400.
Mr. Dawkins: for Bayfront Park? That's on top of all the money they got from
the State. I'm talking to the Manager now, sir. That's all. OK, go ahead, I
will get to his later. OK, the only thing I got, Mr. ...
Mr. Plummer: All right, hold on. Basically, we can read numbers out of the
book, OK? Let's go to questions.
Mr. Davkinst The only question I have is that Mr. Manager, and the Splashdown
was a success. Now much money did we spend on the Splashdown, anybody?
$12,000? I'd like to see $20,000 budgeted for the Splashdown next year, Old?
Thank you, Mr., that is all I got.
Mr. Plummer: Mr. Do Turre.
Mr. De Turret Teo, I got a few questions.
Mr. Plummer: All right, sir.
Mr. De Turre: What page do we have the revenues for our stadiums and all that
kind of thing?
Mr. Plummer: Stadiums?
Mr. De Turret 15? Where do we have last year's, or this year's numbers?
Mr. Plummer: It is on the same page. You mean for the...
Mr. De Turret I want
a comparison of
what has been
generated
traditionally,
because I've seen that
the projections
for next year
are up and
above, way up
and above what has been
traditionally,
and I want an
explanation
for that.
Mr. Plumsser: Well, for example, the Marine Stadium last year... oh no,
is the total estimate revenue...
Mr. Odin: Was three twenty three, and we projected three twenty one.
Mr. Plusmeer: But Is the total estimated, is that estimated for Wit,
year or the coming year?
Mr. Odio: We hays two estimates bare.
Mr. Plummer: Yell for what year is it? It doesn't say.
or. Odlo: 'id•'dt.
'1B
or. Plummer: I understand that. Why would You have two estimates?
Mr. Odiot One is what we have for this Year, where it says what we foal it
has to be most year.
Mr. Plummtrt Is the first column last year?
Mr. Odiot Too.
Mr. Plummer: Why is it an estimate? Oh, it is an estimate until the end of
the year.
Mr.
Odio: because it
is from the
budget. We don't know until September 30th.
It's
actually down if
you compare
this, as I read it, right, the first column
Is
this year's budget
versus nest
year.
Mr. Plumnor: So the first column is estimated revenue and the second column
is estimated expenses. So you expect to make in the Marine Stadium $2,150?
Mr. Odlo: Yes, sir.
Mr. Plummer: The wording is misleading.
Mr. Odiot That is how you deal in this, its, government surplus or whatever.
We are saying that we'll break oven at the bobby Maduro Stadium, that the
Orange Soul Stadium should make a profit of $102,000, that the Dinner Key
Marina will break oven and there we normally had a huge profit, so we are
really under because of the construction. Ve art underestimating that and the
debt service payment, that we won't have a profit in the Marina for the first
time in years. And Mismarina is showing a profit of $96,000. to we are just
saying that the total profit or surplus will be $201,000 for the enterprise
fund on the facility.
Mr. Plummer: Commissioner Do Turre.
Mr. Do Turre: Yes, I an looking at this little, I don't know if it is in-
house booklet that you all have.
Mt. Al Howard: That is correct, Commissioner.
Mr. De Turre: OK, I am looking at the revenue reports, 7-31-68 versus 7-31-
67.
Mr. Plummert Excuse me, do we all have a copy of that book?
Mr. Odiot I don't have that.
Mr. Howard- No, those just eventually we had given the Commissioner when we
had gone over.
Mr. Dawkinst Victor De Turre has somebody who goes around just slicing things
off here.
Mr. Howard: No, that* wasn't any, Commissioner. We had a opportunity to meet
with Commissioner Do Turre and we presented sows information to him.
Mr. Odlo: Well, I'm glad I haven't soon it. Tou know what I lean?
Mr. Do Turrt: Voll, you see, that is why you have to go to these hearings.
Mr. Plummert Well, go ahead. Hopefully we can follow it.
Mr. Odio: Normally Uw Matter says the City l aaa#er aesw the Lotee a
first, and I haven't seen it. s=
Mr. Plummer: go ahead, lot's too if we can't follow it. I'll M41"
Consecutive ttaaslstion right now. r.X
Mr. Do Turre: OK, Solos down the line, I's looking at the bistasiaai 11001row '
oI the 104 41 1t sos like NeU6900 0 I iMPi spe "66 4e11 cowne - VAS0 i
Maarise stadiums or~ �s wl., NOW x0r, M1� t: iMa ��Mr��N{�
a
v
the projections of revenues for the upeoming year and eome of them seem may in
excess of what is traditionally been genersted, and t mart exr1�rA" ^'* f^r
&& A S.A16-
Mr. Howard: Which in particular would you like, Commissioner?
Mr. De Turre: Wall, we can start with Melreese Golf Course. You had as of 7-
31-86, an income or revenue report of $516,000 and now you are showing
projected revenues for the coming year of $812,000, which is about $300,000
more, about 60 percent more.
Mr. Howard: One of the things that we are doing, starting in October, we are
raising the fees $2.00 on the greens fees, and also the carts will be being
increased, which would generate probably about $86,000 just by raising those
fees. We are hopeful of putting in a saw irrigation system. As a matter of
fact, the request is in capital accounts now. If that is approved, and we are
hoping that it will be, to improve that golf course, we could increase our
play down there about 20 percent, so we estimate with what we are taking in
this year... by the way, which would have been a lot higher right now, with
two months ago you could add about $90,000 on to that, but v* lost about is
days, 11 full days with carts and green fees, which amount to about $60,000.
That was because of all the rain we experienced in July and August. We had a
problem with the course closed, it was flooded. Hopefully that won't happen
next year. but, with the increase in fees, and the improvement of the
Irrigation, we should reach our goals.
Mr. De Yurre: OK, now what is the usual green fee?
Mr. Howard: Well, the greens fees now are $14 if you are walking. If you are
take a cart, it is $12. Nov, they are going up to $14 for everybody, and the
carts being $19, they will go up to $20. That will be a resolution before the
Commission.
Mr. De Yurre: OK, now, if you're talking about a $2 increase on a $14 revenue
amount, that is about one -seventh. That's about 16 percent, and yet I am
looking at revenue increase of 60 percent.
Mr. Howard: You have normally about 60,000 golfers to play the course. We
estimate about 40,000 full eighteen hole greens fees. So, the $2 a piece,
that is about $80,000 right there. There is about 20,000 rounds of carts.
20.000 times they rent the cart, at $2 on a cart, that is another $40,000,
that is...
Mr. De Yurre: Everybody uses a cart?
Mr. Howard: No, I am saying only... no, they can walk. 20,000 rounds use a
cart, 40.000 rounds don't use a cart.
Mr. De Turre: OK.
Mr. Howard: So, 20,000 rounds, that is 40,000 players actually, so there are
20,000 players who use them.
Mr. De Turre: but, in a round, so I can understand this, you know I am not...
I understand the golf game, but I want to understand the numbers game in the
golf game. You have 20,000 rounds and you are playing in teams, you know,
that is two, three rounds right there that are playing together, right?
Mr. Howard: No, each individual...
Mr. De Turre: Each
one has their cart?°
a
Mr. Nowardt
Eight,
there were 60,000 players, 60,000 rounds of golf. Vboa
they use a
cart, two people ride in the cart, and we rent normally about
20,000 carts a year,
they go out 20,000 tines, so that maans there are 40,000
people have
use the
carts of the 60,000 rounds. 20,000 walk.
Mr. De Turre: OK,
so then you are talking about 40,000 rounds use cart*,
'
except that
they double
up.xk
Mr. Howard:
Right,
but we are charging... we are going to incrpdoo tbo cart
by $2 also.
So you
have got each round that a player, one individual play&
•
1g Ti
His share will be about $3, because the carts are going up $2, his share is
$1. Bach parson pays $1, and there is $2 increase on greens fees, that is $3
time 60,0C^ rou—'j. :_ ab-,ut W 0,000. Now hopefully, because when we
got this irrigation completed, which will improve...
Mr. be Turret but do you charge par person, the cart?
Mr. Howard: About $3 per person.
Mr. be Turre: but it is per person, it is not...
Mr. Howard: No, if it is $20 a cart, it is $10 a person.
Mr. be Turret OK.
Mr. Howard: They are paying $9 now, so...
Mr. Do Turret well, so we are talking &bout 20,000 rentals time a $2
increase, that is $40,000, right?
Mr. Movard: Right.
Mr. be Turret Now, we are talking about 60,000 rounds at a $2 increase, so
that is $120,000, so sax, we are talking $160,000.
Mr. Howard: Well, I as hopeful... with the irrigation, it is a projection, of
course. With the improvement in irrigation, we are going to bring a lot more
players. One time we averaged at Melreese, 63,000. 64,000. It has dropped
down now 3,000 or 4,000, 5,000 in nose cases, depending upon the weather. We
hope to get those players back. I am estimating that we are going to get those
players back with the improvements to the golf course.
Mr. Plummer: How are prices in comparison to private golf courses?
Mr. Howard: We have caught up. Most courses right now are about $16 on the
carts. I'■ talking about Palmetto, Bayshors, Coral Gables. We are going up
to $20 and some of then say go up to $20. Our greens fees are right now, are
higher than Palmetto and they are higher than Coral Gables, lower than Key
Biscayne. Key Biscayne is considered the championship course around here, but
we are comparable to even prior courses with our cart fees. Our green fees
no, they are quite a bit more than we charge, quite a bit more, because of the
membership cost, initial membership cost, but we have over the years now,
Increased it more than $2 a year to bring it up to where it is comparable now,
and increasing the funds.
Mr. De Turre: OK, based on your numbers, you are going to need about close to
10,000 additional golfers playing next year, to reach the $112,000 you are
talking about.
Mr. Howard: We estimate about 4,000, Commissioner,, everything based on the
Improvements now. It means nor* money on the driving range, because more
people playing. More people...
Mr. De Turre: No, I understand, but I am just looking, if you are talking
about 4,000, that's tops at $14 round figure, that is $56.000.
Mr. Howard: Teo, on the golf course for fees, but in that, above that, we
have estimates for the increase for percentages on the driving range, from the
pro shop and from the restaurant. That increases also.
Mr. be Turret Tom art very optimistic.
Mr. Howard, I am because I as very oxcited about getting a a irtlg#tlea
system in the golf course which we haven't had since 1961 when it epesod. it
causes a lot of anxiety now because if the lines break during Uw !wogs whe4 we
are sot getting ay rain, we have had problem, it hasn't loc* good, so I
think when we get that dons, we are going to be pleasantly awpslosd.
Mr. be Turret OK, the bottom line is Melrease in the best case scoosrio, a"
the figures you arm giving have. Anything goes wreag, they will p .d 1.
Mr. Howards It won't go way down, but we will still be in the bleak,
Mr. De Turre: It will be a loss.
Mr. Howard: We will still be...
Mr. be Turre: OK, let's go to Miami Springs Golf Course. You showed us
basically the sans projected revenue, which is well over $300,000 more than it
was last year. Give me your !ustification for that.
Mr. Noward: Well, the saw basic reasoning, with the increase in the carts
there, and the greens feve, because it is across the board at both golf
courses. One of the problems we have experienced in Miami Springs, for the
last four years they .$"tut the water off there, the spring water, because they
said it was contami•jated. The water from Miami Springs wells services one -
twelfth, or it did service one -twelfth of the drinking water in Dade County.
When they shut that off, the water keeps casing in through the tributaries,
and rises up so wean it rains, the course is flooded, and when I say flooded,
I think you so,, pictures during our demonstration that you can't walk through
the fairway. It really reduced our play. People stayed away, they wouldn't
come to the golf course, you couldn't blame them because in the middle of the
fairway they had to take their shoes off to get a ball if they hit there,
because of the flooding and they won't put the pumps back on. They do
Intermittently, but not enough to help it. Tears ago when it rained...
Mr. De Turre: So what are we doing about that now?
Mr. Howard: OK, I just wanted to add one thing before I gat there. Tears ago
the fastest drying course in the County, the two fastest drying were Siltmore
and Miami Springs. Now, it is one of the worse because of shutting the water
off. Well, we have already dug out the lgth fairway and we brought in the
fill that we are purchasing from the airport from their excavations. We are
filling that up and in about two months that is going to be completed on the
lath. That was our biggest problem. We are moving over to the second hole on
the front side, where we have a problem with the water. We improved this, we
are going to bring those players back. Miami Springs traditionally...
Mr. De Turre: When are you going to do that?
Mr. Howard: We are doing it now.
Mr. De Turre: Right now presently?
Mr. Howard: Right, at present we have already got the fairway scraped off on
the lgth. We are bringing in the fill, leveling it off, putting back the sod,
to eliminate that water problem and make it playable.
Mr. De Turre: How long is that taking?
Mr. Howard: It will take us about two months to finish it.
Mr. De Turre: And then you are going to do what, hole number two?
Mr. Howard: Hole number two, but we don't have to... the hole is not the
entire hole. The lath we have to shut down the par four and make it par
three, and people you know, have a tendency when you are under construction to
stay away for a while, but we should be able to finish that and have that all
put in and partially do the second hole on the side. We hope to have that all
completed and bring the players back. Traditionally over the years, Miami
Springs has more players more than Melreese. If we can get back into that
course, our expectations are higher for the number of players there than we
have at Melreese.
Mr. De Turre: Nov many golfers do we have annually at Miami Springs?
Mr. Howard: Miami Spring's is about 60,000 average, with the sass, but at one
time, back is the late '60's, early '70's, or even into the mid 1?01s, we
averaged sometimes 67,000 to 68,000 in Miami Springs. There was a lot of play
there.
Mr. Ds Turret Let M ask you about your arrangement that we have with the
restaurant there. Can you explain that to met
r{4 b
Q *"*R' 7,
r
Mr. Nowardt At Miami gpringst
Mr. be Turre: Teo.
Mr. 1lowardt Teo, the restaurateur operates the... well, there are two
concessionaires. The restaurateur operates the bar, the snack bar, and he has
three "am where he boo parties, weddings, and so on. Me pays the City 12
percent of all revenues from his concessions.
Mr. Do Turre: Now such do we wake on that?
Mr. Noward: We must probably this year wake in the neighborhood of about
$63,000.
Mr. De Turre: Now such does it cost?
Mr. Nowardt It costs about $31,000 for electricity, Miami pays the cost, so
we not about $30,000.
Mr. Do Turre: What other costs are there?
Mr. Movarde heal neall water charge, he takes care of sever, he takes care of
his ova garbage pickup. The only charge that we basically... he takes care of
cleanup and maintenance of his facility. It is just for the electricity that
the City is paying.
Mr. De Turre: So actually, what is the net that the City makes?
Mr. Novardt Approximately $30,000.
Mr. Do Turret $30,000. Vhen was that contract entered into?
Mr. Odio: OK, it was 10 years and it is over in 1992. He is on his last five
years right now. excuse me, the first one was five years and than two five
year additions on that, that was part of the original contract, so it was 15
years, this is his last five years.
Mr. Do Turre: Lot's go to the Orange Soul. It is shoring revenues projected,
$2,649.000. Last year it was $2,042.000. There is a $600,000 increase.
Mr. Max Cruz: OK. as for this, we requested $2,649,910. OK, right now. the
Orange bowl, without appreciation is $1,669,972.
Mr. Do Turre: What is that?
Mr. Cruz: $1,669,972.
Mr. Do Turre: No, no, what is that figure? What is that figure?
Mr. Gabriel Torras: That is revenue there.
Mr. Cruz: As of 8-31-88.
Mr. De Turret Revenues?
Mr. Cruz: Revenues.
Mr. be Turret OK, bow such is that?`
Mr. Cruz: $1,669,972. We had a bug* gain this last tiws, because we havo owl,
more Coming that is also predict*# to be bin. Vo set to4sto mW 6& Ap: 4
very conservative side, amotber $362,542, coming up.
Mr. Do Tweet OK,
Mr. Crust •362,542.�
Mr. be Turret OK, so that is about $2,200,000.
Mr. Crust $2,232,614. ,4
Mr. be Turret foist tbre*t
F 1
Y
Mr. Crust Tea, point three. Not including appreciation which is t165,000.
Mr. De Turret Includes...?
Mr. Cruz: Depreciation. We should add depreciation at $365,000.
Mr. Plummer: Depreciation on what? What do You mean? I don't wNorotaM
that.
Mr. Torrent It is a son cash eKpense that...
Mr. Tluamaert What?
Mr. Gabriel Torrent It is a son cash osponae that is put on both sides.
Mr. Odiot It is accounting.
Mr. Torres: It is only an accounting procedure.
Mr. Odio: Every City facility has added depreciation.
Mr. be Turret Are we giving some...
Mr. tlun inert Depreciation for what? You can only depreciate something for so
long. That structure is what, 40 years old?
Mr. De Turret Now many?
Mr. llunmort 52 years old.
Mr. De Turret Almost as old as you?
Mr. Odic: It is a Coopers and...
Mr. llunmart Now long can you depreciate?
Mr. Odic: You are right, but Coopers and Lybrand... it is a Coopers and
Lybrand requirement.
Mr. Do Turret Let's blame it on...
Mr. !lu■mer: The hell with Coopers and Lybrand!
Mr. Odic: We have to comply with...
Mr. lluaser: for what?
Mr. Odic: General accepted...
Mr. llua r: Wall, they are telling we I've got to depreciate a 52 year old
structure. Where the hall is Coopers and Lybrand? We need a new auditor.
Mr. Odic: No, no, it is a general accepted accounting principle for City
government.
Mr.
=lunmort
I don't accept it. I
don't accept it because it is not true.
Now,
call it
what it is.
Mr.
Garcia:
Commissioner, it is true that the original building goes back #0 E
pears, but there has boas a lot of
improvements, and those improwsm eta '
the
ones that
have Mew depreciated.
Mr.
Hummers
In that :that you are doprociating?
Mr.
Garcia:
Too, air.
'
Mr.
tlummert
I'll Nit that.
fy
.:
Mr.
Do Turco:
Too, but the tbiq is
that dpproolotiao to f 11100" to ��
e rovelm it".
hi
,.�t�1�+ttkFpi a.v
th
Mr. Terrell That is why you trade it on both sides.
Mr. 1': Turre then, then we are going to...
Mr. Howard: Actually, if you want to disregard depreciation, we are talking
set revenues.
Mr. be Turra: Mold it, let me ask you this. Then where it says budget
request $2,547,000, are we going to be subtracting the three hundred and same
odd thousand there toot
Mr. Torres: In the budget request already includes the $363,0O0 for
depreciation.
Mr. be Turre: So you won't be Setting that amount.
Mr. Torrea: If you really Want to look at it, may the $2,500,000 is actually
$2,200,000.
Mr. De Turret Then if we cam this number through, it will not appear as far
as our actual dollars, tax dollars are concerned. Cesar, is that correct?
Were is Carlos? Carlos Garcia?
Mr. Plummer: Now much of that figure are we still paying off bonds on the
Marine Stadium? That's washed, now that is clean?... because we were paying
from the Orange Bowl bonds on the Marine Stadium. That's out now?
Mr. Garcia: That's out.
Mr. De Turra: Explain to me the procedure about this depreciation, how it
shove on the budget request and how it flows through the whole nine yards.
Mr. Garcia: It is just an accounting entry, Commissioner, as you well know.
I don't know why we show it. I think we show it on the revenue side also to
balance the budget. But there are going to be no resources applied to
depreciation. It is just an entry in the books.
Mr. Do Yurre: There is a book entry...
Mr. Garcia: Right.
Mr. Do Turre: ... shoving the depreciation.
Mr. Garcia: That is right.
Mr. De Turre: There is no actual money being set aside.
Mr. Garcia: There is none.
Mr. De Turre: Isn't the purpose of depreciation to start setting stoney aside
so then you can have the capital outlay to replace in time?
Mr. Garcia: Not necessarily. In some cases that is true, but not
necessarily. One of the main issues is to be able to show an operating
statement that shown all the costs related to that facility and depreciation
Is one of those costs.
Mr. Do Turret Then this $2,500,000, they are not getting $2,500,000 tax
dollars? '
Mr. Garcia: No, they are not, they are not. `
Mr. Odio: Lccuse me. Lot me clarify something right ter, Cowl aisoor. IN
to,
said these are mot tax dollars, period. Anyone of thous dollars yu on'
seeing bore are not tax dollars. This is the enterprise fund.
41,
Mr. llummer: Thera are no tax dollars.;
Mr. Odlot No. Commissioner, this is all...
Mr. lluomro There are so tax dollars in this. y �
F esr +
' f
33,
Mr. Odiot There are so tax dollars involved in this budget whatsoever.
;U. " Tur►•: Well, let's talk about dollars.
Mr. Odiot Dollars, yes.
Mr. be Turre: OK, they are son -existent dollars.
Mr. Garcia: There are so dollars there. The only reason that amount is shown
,% a revenue, it is not a revenue by any means, is that the budget doesn't
show a deficit. Otherwise, if you have all your cash revenues and your cash
expenditures, and in addition you have a bookkeeping entry like depreciation,
you will show a deficit on the budget, and that is the only reason that amount
Is shown there, but it is really of no relevance at all.
Mr. Plumnert Now you see it and now you don't.
Mr. be Turret You never see itl
Mr. Plumnert 0h, you got to know where it is.
Mr. be Turret That is what we are trying to find out.
Mr. Plumsert See, you'll learn one thing about administrative people. You
can believe everything they say. It is what they don't say that you have got
to be worried about. He is answering your questions, but it is not the answer
that you are looking for and he knows that's there.
Mr. Garcia: No, let me just say this, Coassissioner Plummer. For budgetary
purposes, there is no need to show depreciation. OK, we are doing this budget
on a cash basis, and depreciation is not a cash item.
Mr. Plummer: It is truthfully not a wash.
Mr. Garcia: It to a wash, yes.
Mr. Plummer: It is a wash, budgetary, but in fact, in practicality it is not
a wash.
Mr. Garcia: It is not a wash in the sense that when you show financial
statements, you show a deficit for the amount of that depreciation because it
is not being funded.
Mr. Plusimer: Contributions from other sources. You are not showing it here.
That's all right, I know where it is.
Mr. De Turre: The $2,042,000 figure, as of 7-31-88, and the 7-31-87 figure of
two point one seven six, that does not show depreciation, or does it show
depreciation?
Mr. Cruz: Let no see what you are looking at. That 7-31...
Mr. De Turre: 188.
Mr. Cruz: I think he shows appreciation in that one, COMI ssioner.
Mr. be Turret It shows depreciation.
t
Mr. Cruz: Yea, air. Everyone shows depreciation because you low, "M b"o '
to show it in every one, take it you knout, so it will balowo.
Mr. be Turret Late go to Miamarina. := k
Ms. tlussesrt Miami. or Dinner Key?
Mr. De Turret Mismarins.
Mr. Plumeri Oh, you had to bring that one up, sight! ,
Mr. De Turret Well, it says as of 7-31-Se, $366 000,
OdOt �"
;6:2,000, shout i500,000 more there.
24
Mr. Crust Well. it is projected. Mismarins is becoming popular and popular
and we are getting more and more visitors coming in and of course, we ware
anticipating that the marine would be completed, that there will be no
deficiencies in the piore and...
Mr. be Turret by when will it be completed?
Mr. Crust As it is right now, Commissioner, I do not know.
Mr. De Turret Mall, than how can you make this projection? You have to base
It on something.
Mr. Cruz: We were anticipating that this marina would be completed by the end
of this year, and as we go along, we go on an anticipated that it would be,
as you can see in the past, still it was completed, but it was not up to
standards and we didn't have the acceptance of the boating people at first,
Ilk* we anticipated. They are coming back on, and this peat weekend, we got
approximately close to 700 boats that came in over the weekend, so they are
coming in and more and more are casing in and every day. We have got an
extensive campaign of marketing, and I think that that will create more
newcomers to Dayside and the marina.
Mr. De Turret Do you really anticipate that you can sake $842,000 with what
you re telling me right now?... based on your history, how much it has made in
the post?
Mr. Cruz: Also remember that in that is anticipated, there is also
depreciation included.
Mr. De Turre: And this depreciation of $368,000 figure also. Right or wrong?
Mr. Cruz: We do sincerely, I feel that we are going to get to that point.
Mr. Do Turret This coming year?
Mr. Cruz: This coming year. The way the marina, the reaction to the boating
public is coming up to the marina, I think that we are going to get to the
number.
Mr. De Turret No, I can't agree with you on that. Mr. Manager, these
shortfalls, where would the money come from on all these amounts that we are
looking at?
Mr. Odio: If we have a shortfall...
Mr. De Turret You, and I am sure we will, because these are projections that
are 110 percent optimum.
Mr. Odlo: Wall, I believe, and I an looking at the numbers, four years ago
the enterprise fund, we had to cover deficits over $1,000,000 and they have
delivered over these past three years, we haven't very, very few dollars in
deficit, if any and I think that if we have a deficit, of course we will have
to cover it from the general fund.
Mr. Do Turret What we are looking at, you know the profit is marginal based
on these. Do you have a copy of this, did you get one?
Mr. Odio: Tom, I do, I have it now, but the budget is reflecting the same
thing, so from the budget I can tell you we reviewed this very carefully and
we also took out a lot of expenses, that they have done to the last three
years, what they have said they would do. They have boon very accurate about
It, and there is so reason to believe that they are not going to keep that
record intact, unless we have a disaster that they cannot control. Ist ldysl��
In the Dinner Key Marisa, they are moving so fast with eoustsuetiom thAt j" "
might do better than we are projecting here.
Mr. Do Turre: What is your involvement with the Dayfroat lark? ,.
Mr. Cruse I on not involved with Dayfrout lark. ;
Mr. Dawkins: sy the way, since we are talking, Mr. Manager, 4$1 the ,
AXT
administration instruct our lobbyist and people in =allabaairas,
g
roar, our priority is money from the state of Florida for our City parks and
set a dawn pansy for Savfrewt P&O'"
Mr. Odio: I talked to Aurelio. Who is in charge of We told his the
City priorities, we told his to go after inner-city park monies.
Mr. Dawkins: Did you specifically instruct his...
Mr. Odio: Too. I did.
Mr. Dawkina: ... that we want to request from the state of Florida assistance
for parks.
Mr. Odio: Too. I have, iasor-city parks.
Mr. Dawkins: We don't need another $750,000 for Sayfroat Park.
Mr. Odio: No, we don't.
Mr. Dawkins: If the State is going to give us any money, we need it for the
City parks.
Mr. Odio: Too, sir.
Mr. Dawkins: OK, because last year when I got up there. I understand that we
did not do it in September, therefore it was not considered a priority.
Mr. Odio: We are going to, we are starting now with our priorities, so that
we don't wait until the last minute.
Mr. Dawkins: Who is the legislative person for the office?
Mr. Odio: Aurelio Peres.
Mr. Dawkins: All right, I would like to meet with his Friday. OK, I will Sot
with you Friday. Thank you. Frank, go right ahead, I am sorry, Frank.
Mr. Odio: We did add monies into this budget in the Parka Department for
Sayfront Park, Counissioner and while I did not add dollars to the budget per
so, it came out of operating expenses savings. When we identified the savings
as we were preparing the budget, the leftover monies were applied to Sayfront
Park. which was what?
Mr. Al Howard: $175,000.
Mr. Odio: $175,000, and not before. In other words, the budget was prepared
with our priorities of every City park in mind first. After we reviewed the
budget for the last time, we identified $175,000 of operating expenses that
they didn't meet because we went to actual expenditures, and that is the
monies that we used for Sayfront Park. We did not add dollars to the budget
for Sayfront Park.
Mr. Dawkins: Yes, but Sayfront Park, the $175,000, is the money that was
requested by the trust in order to operate the park efficiently. Is that
right?
Mr. Odlo: No.
Z.
Mr. Howard: They had requested a great deal more than that.
Mr. Odio: They requested $500,000.
Mr. Howard: Yes, a great deal more than the $175,000. That is a basis a"iw*
so we asa operate the park starting... we are operating with existing terms
now, but what we did with salary savings, we actually sawed a met to
i175,000 in there for staff effective October 1, it it is paesedl . o Vee _1[iif 4
f,
have a full tun staff at sayf cost lack. W dealt have it new.
Mr. sla■wsr: Who will have staff?
Mr. Nevord: We will be.
�� .
Mr. liar: The City or the trust?
Mr. Noword: Out of the Si15.000, the City --'_t! %a maintaining leyfront lark.
Mr. Dewkina: wall, what is the trust going to do?
Mr. Howard: They are handling Dayside, but they...
Mr. Dawkins: No, so. so.
Mr. Howard:... have administrative contract with the City to receive funds,
$133,000 for administration, but not for maintenance. (light now we are
maintaining that park.
Mr. Dawkins: Vell, be prepared, that is the one I will take up after.
Mr. Flummar: Mr. Manager, that was not the understanding.
Mr. Noward: And they take in all of the money from all of the events, it does
Into their trust.
Mr. Plummer: They are telling us that you are spending $175,000 for
maintenance?
Mr. Odio: No, I haven't spent it. Ve are asking here that allow us to do
that.
Mr. Flunmer: And give than $135,0007 For what?
Mr. Odio: No, we are not giving...
Mr. Plummer: And they are taking all of the revenues?
Mr. Odio: No, no.
Mr. Plummer: Vell, that is what he just told us, I am sorry!
Mr. Howard: They had received $135,000 previously, for administration.
Mr. Odio: This year. You allowed us. you approved, voted on that. Vhat I ,m
saying is that...
Mr. Plummer: but what he is...
Mr. Odio: What I am saying is, that we are putting here one hundred fifty...
Mr. De Turret That was for this running fiscal year.
Mr. Odio: '67'-188, you voted on $135,000.
Mr. Dawkins: $135,000.
Mr. Odio: I'■ not giving them $135,000 here. Ve allocated $1759000 for the
maintenance of the park and we are saying that is all it is...
Mr. Plummer: To be done by our people.
Mr.
Odio: i<y our
people.
Mr.
Dawkins:
OK,
well what are they supposed
to maintain with their Some,
Mr.
Odio: They ware never supposed to maintain. They cams in mad 44td t1r
wanted..._
Mr.
Plummer:
No.
without than we still have to
maintain it.
r ,4 :.
Mr.
Dawkins:
Mo,
we wouldn't have it without
them. in order to aa
q �
Park without
them,
without the loyfrost Trust,
we wouldn't b"q the
.:-
Mr.
liusrssr:
No,
we had the park before.
4
f
T.
Mr.
Dawkins: we, you had
the park after they gent and...
by the way, we have
Mr.
Marty Pine, who is a
very civic minded individual.
Marty, if you have
►v .ay, and you
have to leave, we will... %* .
Mr.
011ie: Cosnissioner Kennedy sent me a message. I don't
know if she will be
Is,
that she wanted to be
here when we discussed sayfront
Park.
Mr. Hawkins: say what soar?
Mr. Plunmer: We don't want her here)
Mr. Odlo: Comaissioner Kennedy *sat me a message that ohs wanted to wait...
Mr. Dawkins: Wall, if she doesn't sake it by MOO o'clock, she will not
Mar... I do not plan to be bore after... I personally as not coming back this
afternoon.
Mr. Odio: Teo, sir.
Mr. Dawkina: I don't know about you.
Mr. Odic: let us explain one more time what we did here. We prepared the
Parks budget. As I review every line item in the budget, one by one, we found
that they had money in the budget that they didn't need for operating
expenses.
Mr. Dawkins: Mold it, hold it! There is no way in the world, Mr. Manager, I
an going to let you sit here and tell the press and the rest of the citizens
of Miami...
Mr. Odio: Teo, air.
Mr. Dawkins: ... that with the condition that inner-city and all other parka
are in, that you've got $175,000 that we can't spend on parks!
Mr. Odio: No, let me clarify, Commissioner.
Mr. Dawkins: Please do!
Mr. Odio: I went ....let•o take... We took the line items for pencils and in
the past few years they used $50 on pencils, and they had in the budget
$1,000. I took $9SO out. We went down the line itsm of gasoline, they used
$10.000 for the last throe years, and tbey bad $20,000. I took $10,000 out.
That's how we did the budget this year. What we tried to do is, the budget,
the way it was done before is an incremental budget, and what we said this
year, we did not want an incremental budget, we wanted actual expenditures per
line items, so when we finished doing that, we found that there was $17S,000
allocated to different line items that the monies would never had been spent.
Mr. Dawkins: Right, so...
Mr. Odlo: so now what we are saying is, and it is your decision, we had
$175,000 left over, we put into bayf ront Park, and that In all the Money we
are going to spend in sayf ront Park.
Mr. Dawkins: And you put it in the boyfront Park because it is needed to
maintain the park, not because we couldn't find no place else to put it.
Mr. Odio: That's correct. Oh, I could spend the soney in any park all right.
Mr. Dawkins: but see, don't lead us to believe that you put it over there...`
Mr. Odin: I'a glad...
Mr. Dawkins: ... because we couldn't put it so place oleo.;.r
Mr. Odio: ... you are hero, Commissioner.
Mr. Dawkins: OK, all right.
Mr. be Turre: I'd like to know, Hmord,
maintaining that park owes all?
x
It'
Mr. Howard: As for as the maintenance of the grounds, it will be
.���•-��stel• e11S,00A.
Mr. be Turre: wlhat other expenses do we have in the park?
Mr. Howard Ye have the electrical expense, the repair expense, general
services, we always considered that within the $175,000, just in Taff r*at
Park. We feel we can maintain it with the manpower that we get with the
$175,000 and the utilities that we have there.
Mr. De Turret wlhst about the salaries?
Mr. Howard: Ye plan on putting a foreman in there with six park...
Mr. De Turret No, beyond the hundred and... that will be included with the
$175,000. 1 sm talking about beyond that, the function of the park.
Mr. Howard: The function of the park is handled by Sayside.
Mr. be Turret By sayside?
Mr. Odiot No, no, by the trust!
Mr. Howard: By the trust, by the trust.
Mr. Plummer: Teo, but you see, that is fine, and Cosmissioner Kennedy should
be here because it is my understanding they are coming with a request for
$600,000. Now...
Mr. Odiot It is not here.
Mr. Dawkins: Tou phrased it right, a request.
Mr. Plummer: Yell, OK, fen, but I mean he is not getting full answers, is
what I sm saying, because they are definitely, regardless of what that number
In, are looking for subsidy from the City, and you are saying that you have
not a dine in this budget to subsidize that board.
Mr. Odiot We have a $175,000 to maintain that park. Otherwise, we haven't
another dollar in here.
Mr. Do Turre: They are going to be in a heap of trouble.
Hr. Plummert Oh, I have been saying that for a long time!
Mr. Howard: As for as the shows in the park, sayfront Park, the trust handles
that. We have no expenses there whatsoever. They have the income and they
pay the expenses for the maintenance, the event personnel and security for
each event, so it really doesn't cost the City any amount of money there. It
is only for the overall maintenance of the whole park that we are involved
with, not for the event.
Mr. De Turret OK, lot me ask you, the FEC property that was sold to the
County, have we closed on that yet?
Mr. Plummer: The what?
Mr.
Ds Turret
Didn't we Siva them a piece of the
FiC?
r
Mr.
Pluwer:
Oh, wall yes, for the causeway.
Mr.
Odiot The closing date is in the hands of the
lawyers right aswr, ills
fr P
finalised the
arrangement.>>"
Mr.
be Turret
Were are we at with than
£.
Mr.
Fernandes:
Ye are ready to clogs.
fd
i
Mr.
Plwwsart
Do w have the woury In the k!},
�-
Mr.
Fernandes:
no, not fret, we bav*n't closed.
i
2 �
t'
Mr. tlummort Then we are sot ready, because they have been procrastinating
.rose, &or two yearal
Mr. to Turret rot two years?
Mr. Fernandes: We he" all the documents now that we seeded. Closing should
be within two weeks•
Mr. Plunwert Don't hold your breath.
Mr. Do Turret now such money is the selling price?
Mr. Fernandes: rive point...
Mr. Flsrart rive point three.
Mr. Fernandes: exactly.
Mr. be Turret What are we projected to do with that money?
Mr. tlusmer: It is already spent.
Mr. be Turret On what?
Mr. Odio: It is already spent in the park.
Mr. Do Turret In the park?
Mr. Odio: It was divided in half. Half of it would go to cover inner-city
parks, in the bonds, am I correct, Carlos?
Mr. Plummer: $6,000,000 each.
Mr. Odlo: And the other half went to the Sayfront Park.
Mr. De Turret What have we done with our share of the inner-city parks?
Mr. Odiot That was decided in a plan to spend in each park, a committee was
created...
Mr. De Turret Is that part of the $8,300,0007
Mr. Odio: Teo. Teo, sir.
Mr. Dawkins: That is it; that is not a part of it.
Mr. Plummer: There is eight for each side.
Mr. be Turret but not from the sale of the property.
Mr. Plummer: Oh no, that was only $5,300,000. There was other sources
Mr. Odio: $5,900,000. It was $5,900,000, the sale of the property and that
was split in half, $5,900,000.
Mr. Plummer: Call it $6,000,000. What he is asking is, the total for eaob
side was $6,000,000, which was $16,000,000. Tou have accounted for
$6,000,000. where did the other $12,000,000 cone from?
`
Mr. Odio: bond sales, Sunshine State Fund Pool, or whatever they call that..
Mr. Dawkins: That's the money that they were going to put into %W~
Until I dtmandad that than spood dollar for dollar on all the a ns 16�tl►.
parks, it they spend a dollar sort on bayfroot Park and that's 'bss tbor
up with the $16,000,000 and split it damthe middle and put ii, 0,4 to
each side.
_
Mr. Tlvamor: With soothes proviso, that they could sot
p � d
park until they spent it per dollar in the city parks.
i
Y
,�
Mr. bawkins: And thay have alrsedy *Pont all the money in bayf root Park and
not sae penny on the other parks, not one penny,
Mr. be Turret What is the total cost right nor, the Sayfront Park? Where are
we at?
Mr. Plummer: Whet are you including?
Mr. be Turret Zvorything.
Mr. Plumper: everything? $30,000,000.
Mr. Odio: $30.200,000, something like that.
Mr. Dawkins: And counting.
Mr. Odio: but we are talking, and we still...
Mr. Plummer: It comes from an original process that saps that not one penny
would came from taxpayers' dollars, and it is all but $1,000,000 came from the
taxpayers' dollars.
Mr. Do Turret The $8,300,000 for the inner-city parks, is that sitting in a
bank account right now waiting to be used?
Mr. Plummer: No, it is not in a bank account, can't be, you haven't collected
the $5,900,000.
Mr. Odio: We do have the money from the Sunshine State in the bask. We are
still $6,000,000 short.
Mr. Plummer: Tao, but you are still $6,000,000 shortl He asked was all of
the money in the bank, the answer is nol
Mr. Odio: No, no, we are waiting for the closing to got the rest of the
money.
Mr. Do Turret OK, I have no further questions.
Mr. Plummer: Victor brought up an area that I am concerned about. I am
concerned in the area of basically the areas that are under construction. I
don't think there is any way, and Max, I don't agree with you, Miamiarina is
not going to cams up with those kind of funds this year. There is no way it
can happen, between the court suit and everything else that is going on.
Mr. Odio: We ore not under construction, there Commissioner, and the marina
Is fully open, so we are not losing revenue.
Mr. Plummer: but it is not fully occupied.
Mr. Odio: It is not fully occupied...
Mr. Plummer: What is the occupancy right now?
Mr. Odio: but remember, and I asked this question. Let ass...
Mr. Plower: Can I get an answer?
a'
Mr. Odio: Teo, sir, I...;
x
Mr. Plummer: What is the occupancy right jm w? a .
Mr. Odio: We don't have an occupancy, that is What l M trying to tall F".
Mr. tlwrssr s Thon %be answr is none.
Mr. Odlos That warts*, it is a transient mamma, VIVA... x
Mr. Plummer: It is a what?
Mr. Orion Transient.
Mr. Crust Transient marina.
Mr. Odic: We get people in, they pay so many dollars an hour and than they
leave. We don't have people staying there full time.
Mr. Plummer: I'll ask sty question again. What is the basic daily occupancy
rate?
Mr. Odiot Ok, give his that.
Mr. James Bledsoe: I don't have the enact figure for you, Commissioner, but I
will get it for you.
Mr. Plt■ssert No, I want it now, because let me tell you something, I think we
maybe seed to make some changes oe this thing. If you are going to tell ma
that the occupancy daily rate is eight percent, then I think we need to change
some rules and regulations about Mismarine, OK? I am not saying live -aboard*,
but I M saying maybe we need to go start doing sane monthly, because this
figure to ate is a joke. Tou will never ever cans near this figure this year.
Mr. gledsoet Miamarins is strictly transient, Commissioner, so you will have
so live-aboards.
Mr. Plummer: Maybe we need to change that)
Mr. Cruz: OK, Commissioner, one of the biggest things that we will have to
change there, most of the piers are for larger boats and don't have that many
larger boats coming in. A smaller boat will come in if some of the piers were
reduced and that is what we are planning to do when we get into the new...
Mr. Plummer: Max, let s:e tell you why this is a classic example of why all
government people should come from the private sector. If you got an smpty
slip, an empty slip generates zero revenue. Now, if you don't have a 60
tooter to put in there, you put a 30 foot, and at least you get sass revenue.
Mr. Odic: Let us look into this one because I want...
Mr. Plummer: Mr. Manager, I am saying to you... I m going to ask my question
again, for which I've not got an answer. What is the average daily occupancy
of that marina?
Mr. Cruz: Right now I think we have got around 20 boats in the marina. They
are coming in, they are beginning to come in, and the later part of the year.
Mr. Plummer: Mr. Cruz. Mr. Manager, what is the average daily occupancy of
the marina?
Mr. Odic: Twenty.
Mr. Cruz: Twenty.
Mr. Plumiser: Twenty boats? How many slip* do you have?
Mr. Cruz: One hundred -fifty.
Mr. Odlot One hundred -fifty.
Mr. Pluwmar: Why do I have to tell you that there needs to be sass chasgss?
Mr. 0410: fecause the original plan, when iaysido was built, Comrsission9r,
was to have this as a transient marine, that we...
Mr. Plussser: The original plan obviously is not working. ,f>
Mr. Odiot OK, sow we are, I was...
c, L.
Mr. Pluwwer: It you have 20 boats a day, you are tal" *boat Ot UW
on incsste of roughly $300, au I correct?
Mr. Crust Too, Cowwissioser.
may'+
Mr. PlumMer: OK, *bore is the calculator? Mere, the genius with a
calculator, $300 a day by $365. Mow such does it bring you? We are saying
roughly $300 a day. multiplied by 365. What is tnot total revenue?
INAVDISLIt BACKGROUND CQMMDM'S NOT MMTMD INTO THE MLIC RECORD.
Mr. Plummer: No.
Mr. Odio: No, so.
Mr. Plummer: Tom are so longer the genius on the calculator.
VAID=NTIFIED SPEAKER: $109,500.
Mr. Plummer: $109,000 and you are projecting, you are projecting $842.000?
It's a joke,
Mr. Cruz: The transients at the marina are the ones that are caking the
money. Commissioner, under the contract with Tayside, we can only have 40
percent permanent, and the rest have to be transient.
Mr. Odio: Commissioner, we are stuck with a contract. We are stuck with a
contract with the Rouse Company.
Mr. Plummer: Mr. Manager.
Mr. Odio: I didn't write that contract.
Mr. Plummar: Tou are not stuck with a contract.
Mr. Odlo: Tes, sir, we are.
Mr. Plummer: Well than, I will tell you what. If you take that attitude,
from this day forward, tell Sayside, don't ever come into this Commission
again to negotiate any part of their contract. Donal
Mr. Odio: Good, they are coming tomorrow. You can tell them
Mr. Plummer: That's fine. Now, don't tell me you are stuck with anything.
Mr. Odio: Commissioner, we have a contract.
Mr. Plummer: Than fine, they are stuck with a contract and don't ever come in
for any kind of changes. Now, what you are telling me here right now, an
average of $100,000...
UNIDENTIFIED SPEAKER: $110.000.
Mr. Plummer: $110,000, but you are telling me in this funny book, that you
are going to make $642,000.
Mr. Odio: Where you make the money is not on the 20 that stay there, but on
the people coming in, they stay five hours and leave, and they do pay, what,
75 cents?
Mr.
Plummer: And what is that average on a day?
Mr.
Odio: They pay 75 cents a linear foot.
Mr.
Plummer: Now such is that on there?'j
Mr.
Crust Last weekend there was over 700 boats, during the
lest wooko". ' r :.
r
Mr.
Plummer: What was your total revenue take?
�<
Mr.
Crust I don't have it right now, Commissioner.,°°
Mr.
Plummors I'• telling you that this number here is
naRbers Oet! h
and
I think that is what be was trying to bring out.
There
is !le «`-
beach that nuimbtr 1
Mr.
Odiot New much are we going to reach this current
yearT
z �
Ve. llw w r: Well, he is saying $642,000. Cesar.
Mr. Odio: Me, no, I am not saying next year. I seen the current year, tall
his the sales for this year, projected to September loth.
tWID021FIID SPIAKIA: About $457,000.
Mr. Cruel $457,000.
Mr. Odio: $457,000, but we were closed down half of the year. Comaissioser
Plummer, the marina was not operational for all of this year. We are
projecting that it will...
Mr. Plummer: And it is not going to be for next year.
Mr. Odio: We are projecting that it can be, that it will be.
Mr. Plummer: Wish in one hand...
Mr. Odio: No, so, because we are going to be in court for a year.
Mr. Plummier: I understand you are going to be in court and that is the very
reason I sm saying that you are not going to be operational.
Mr. Odio: We cannot do anything there until we finish with the court case,
therefore the marina will be open for the whole year, that is what we are
saying.
Mr. Plummer: You know what? I will be around here next year to remind you.
Mr. Odio: Look, they are trying to be... I don't know if they are being over
optimistic, from the records, every time we have a long weekend, like we just
had... I was there Sunday, and they made a lot of money.
Mr. Plumper: No question on Labor Day weekend you are going to have an
unusual crowd, but you have got Sl other weekends.
Mr. Odio: No, according to the marina operator, there are...
Mr. Crux: Every weekend, we get a busy, busy schedule every weekend, no
matter whether it is a holiday weekend, any regular weekend, you go by there,
Commissioner, and you will sea a lot of boats in that marina.
Mr. Odio: I wanted to know, I asked the same question you did, Commissioner,
on Sunday, why don't we rent the space out like we do on Dinner Key and than
they immediately went back and...
Mr. Plummer: OK, let me ask the other aide of the coin. Since you can allow
by contract, which the Manager says you are stuck with, how many 40 percents
40 you have in there?
Mr. Odio: We have 20, I think.
Mr. Dawkins: Well, we finally got a City...
Mr. Plummer: On a monthly basis.
Mr. Crux: On a monthly basis we have about 20. a
}r
Mr. Dawkins: We finally got a City Attorney who can help us with the budget. Y`
Come in and have a seat, darling. �V
Mr. Crux: We have that problem that boat* cam in, as soon as tlWsP tie, 0 ,
Of the polo* comes loose and the boat will not stay is the 1"r&&8, pw Willey
leave, Ws'va get Somme repair problems in that marina that bae '
boa► ts'i�l
Place- and that is why ones those problems are cured, I as pesiti+►e t1�st
Will sea a better looking series. o ;.
Mr. Plummer: Max, flax, I say you are full of it. It ain't SOU4 0
ain't going to say so sore.#`
•
•
Mr. Crest I will be here sent year, Cossissioner.
Mr. Dawkins: OK, that is the and of that one. Mr. Msnager
Mr. Odio: Too, sir.
Mr. Dawkins: We sat up a fund to fund festivals, and what is left in that
budget for the Florida Orange Blossom Classic, ghat amount?
Mr. Odio: Wall, the festival funding was a hundred...
Mr. Dawkins: No, no. What amount of money, because you sea, people are going
to come before us...
Mr. Odio: Tos.
Mr. Dawkins: ... at the Cotniseion, and I don't intend to be embarrassed and
ghat hove you. I'm going to iron it out now and have it understood bare what
you art going to do with what you got. Nov, what is left for Florida AIM this
year?
Mr. Odiot Just one second.
Mr. Dawkins: &*cause it decreased by 20 percent. Comte on, Mr. Castaneda,
somebody.
Mr. Odio: We have $200,000 in the budget for special events. Florida would
be reduced by 20 percent, every year until they...
Mr. Dawkins: OK. we started out with how many dollars? Mr. Castaneda...
Mr. Odio: Lot me come back with that. Do you have the answer here, Frank?
Mr. Castanoda: I do not know the exact number. I can got it for you, but
I've got to get...
Mr. Odio: Then let's got all the numbers and give his a report of that.
Mr. Castaneda: OR, it is a Cossaission agenda item for this Thursday, I
believe.
Mr. Odio: Tex it is.
Mr. Dawkins: You have $200,000 budgeted, is that right?
Mr. Castaneda: That is right. Commissioner.
Mr. Dawkins: How many events are we going to fund from the $200,000?
Mr. Castaneda: OK, what we have done is that every event gets reduced by 20
percent, that means that there is $40,000 freed up every year and the
Commission decides to fund some events.
Mr. Dawkins: go $200,000 minus $40,000 is $160,000. How many events have to
be divided into $140.000 for se to determine how such money got* to each
event?
Mr. Castaaodat OK, there is a specific formula that reduces aviary event by 20
percent, so the $160,000 are allocated, I Just don't have that figure with as,
but I can got it for you right now, if you vast to. There is $40,000 r
available of which, it I recall correctly, I think...
Mr. Dawkins: I don't vast it, the $40.000, forest it. $160.000. or $1$000"1
Mr. Castasoda: It is $160,000, what is allocated...
Mr. Dawkiast $160,000.l'
N Y1-
Mr. Castowda: $40,000 asailocattdd, but excasa. Mo tbi" the SS", r.
that they ware going to give part of that w aty to VS.
s
4
yt`{ 4.
,2
Mr. Dawkins: Forest the 00,000, forget that, OK? Of the festivals that we
are going to fund, how any did we decide to fund? Vas it four?
Mr. Plummere Five.
Mr. Dawkins All right, five.
Mr. Plummer: $40,000 each for five, it was reduced ovary year...
Mr. Dawkins: All right, so five into $160.000 gives you what?
AIIDINTIFIED SPIAKER: $32,000.
Mr. Dawkins: All right, $32,000. and Bethune-Cookman is supposed to got sass
of that $32,000, but I am just going to use $32,000. All right now, thank
you. Nov, we got $32,000 for the Orange Blossom Classic. All right, right?
Mr. Castoneda: Lot so got the item and I will give you an answer exactly.
Mr. Dawkins: That's OK, I ass going to work with $32,000, it doesn't matter,
you got what you got. All right now...
VNIDENTIFIED SPIAKER: Bethune-Cookman College cancelled their event for
September 17th.
Mr. Dawkins: They cancelled their event, but we didn't cancel giving them the
money? OK, right, they had enough people within their organisation who knew
that they were going to have an event and lose money. I praise them for it,
rather than condemning them for it. Now, of the $32,000, how much is rental
on the stadium? I want all of us to hear this, because all of noed to hear
this. Nov such is rental on the stadium?
Mr. Cruz: The total cost for last year was, if you pay the same thing this
year, was $17,360. The total cost last year was $17,360.
Mr. Dawkins: So we are talking about $18,000 approximately, for the use of
the stadium. All right, take $1e,000 from $32,000. All right, you got
$14,000 for the Orange Blossom Classic. All right, what does fire, police and
sanitation cost?
INAUDIBLE BACKGROUND COMMZNTS NOT ENTERED INTO T*M PUBLIC RECORD.
Mr. Dawkins: No, sea, that's where the hang-up is, OKI It's not included if
It doesn't pay for it, J.L. We got $32,000 and when the Orange Blossom
Classic comes before us, and than we toll them that we are assisting you, ..nd
we got $32,000, they leave the Coasmission Chamber assuming that the $32,000
pays for the stadium, sanitation, fire, police and everything else, and than
It won't do that. Nov, where is Joe Ingraham, somebody over there give me
some figures from last year for cleanup.
Mr. Plummer: You moan for cleanup? $6,500 is what they paid per game.
Mr. Dawkins: All right, $6,500 per game. All right, so that is $6,500. All
right, what is the police?
Mr.
Plummer:
Depending on the crowd.
Mr.
Cruz: The police for the Orange Bowl, is included in expenses.
Mr.
Dawkins:
But they have a parade. The police for the parade
is not
Included
in...
you sae, it is sot included In the expense. So sow,
wbst
the
police for the parade?
Mr.
Plummer:
Is the budget so tight they can't turn the air back on?
>
t�.
Mr.
Dawkins:
Well. we are not that old, i an, .I.L. and I •rat.
�
oldest ones in bare, we are not c awplaini�.
Mr.
Plummer:
We are goiog through the change of life.
Mr.
Dawkins:
Olt, what is the cleanup... I Kean, what to the pollsl►?
ft.
36
a''`
•
0
INAVDIBLR BACKCROUMD CMUMA NOT ANTRW INTO THK PUBLIC 1l MM.
Mr. Dawkins: All right, well with that crowd, I mesa, estimatet All right,
well, let's say $3,000. to sow we are up to S9,SO0, and fire, let's may
1,000. Bo, we say $1,000, you are up to $10,500, OK? I Seen, but just asks
sure that when they Bowe before us, that you tell them what you are paying for
mad what you are sot paying for.
Mr. Plummer: They cancelled this year?
Mr. Cruz: Bethune-Cookman College is the one that cancelled the some.
Mr. Plummer: Mr. Manager, at my urging, and it is going to be in house and I
Suess maybe we ought to talk about it right now. For the first time we are
going to ace the Pig Bowl in the Orange Bawl.
Mr. Dawkisss This time?
Mr. Plummer: OR, now that is what I consider in-house. Now, have adequate
funds been put aside so that it doesn't cost anything?
VNIDSNTIFItD SPZ=R: No.
Mr. Plummers Tou've sot to... you sent ue a acme on it.
Mr. Odio: No, no, the moo we sent was that we are trying to negotiate with
the Los Angeles Police Force to see if they would have a gams here.
Mr. Plummer: Joe, when is the Pig Bowl scheduled in the Orange Bowl? It is
right around January, right during the...
Mr. Cruz: January...
Mr. Plummer: It is in Super fowl week.
Mr. Cruz: January 12th of 1989, 1 believe. It is the Saturday before the
Super Bowl.
Mr. Plummer: Mr. Manager, you sent male a now on it.
Mr. Cruz: Two Saturdays before.
Mr. Plummer: Now, the question, the question I am asking...
Mr. Odio: Well, I scheduled it...
Mr. Plummer: ... this is in house. Rave we not aside the funds necessary so
that it doesn't cost them anything?
Mr. Dawkins: No, we haven't, but we will.
Mr. Plummer: Nov, what do I need to do? Do I need to do it in the budget, or
at the City Commission? I am assuming the police are going to provide their
own security and not ask us to pay for that, now, I would hope.
Mr. Odio: That's the way it happens, but the only other expense we will hove
Is the cleanup of the Orange Bowl. There is an...
Mr. Plummer: OK, simple question.
Mr. Odio: The profits that we have, that some will produce, they go to 'United
Way and according to what I know about Tamiami, they take the ea<peaY• out,
and the balance, the net, to what goes to United Yay.,
Mr. Plummer: Mr. Manager, speaking for awe, I vast to pnmids that Ora"
Bowl to the Police Departmeat free of charge, and so cost to theme. Da I de It
In budget, or do I do it is regular Commission moetingt Now do I Mamdl* t#%t.,
is what I am saying.
INAM1312 BACKOROWV f,90M T$ MOT LIT? W INTO MLIC IMM.r ' '
1
x .v
Mr. Plummer: fine air. Joe, you heard. Me will take care of it. Do I have
any more questions of theme? No. I just...
3. POLICE DEPARTMENT PRESENTATION. (See label 1)
Mr. Dawkins: OK, Mr. Manager, I'd like to bring the gentleman back up who is
handling the police station. Mr. Wright, come up, Mr. Wright. Mr. Manager,
Mr. Wright was hired as a consultant to assist with the shaving off the cost
of the police station and Mr. Wright told me that he worked with the City of
Mimi to show that the stadium could have been bought in at cost and could be
bought in at cost... I swan, the police station, so I said the best place to
have it bore is, have these two gentleman here, and let's find out who is
swing what, and what it is. Now, Mr. Wright, will you tell me what you told
M in my office? State your name and address.
Mr. Edward C. Wright: Edward C. Wright - Wright, Rodriguez, Schindler,
Architects, 00 SW Sth Street, Suits 2110. To give a little bit of background
on the project...
Mr. Dawkins: No, no, I don't need the background. Tell us, you know, what
you come up with. Go ahead, do it your way, I im sorry.
Mr. Wright: OK, we were asked to evaluate, engineer the project, to bring it
In at a budget of approximately $4,400,000. The original cost of the police
station was projected at $5,300,000, and we were asked to take off
approximately $1,000,000 off the project.
Mr. Plummer: Construction.
Mr. Wright: Construction cost of the project. After we completed our
drawing, we had an independent estimate done that indicated that the project
could be done at approximately $3,900,000.
Mr. Plummer: $3,900,000?
Mr. Wright: Tom. We are in the process of receiving back credit from the
contractor. At this point we have received around $610,000 back and the
adjusted bid amount at this point is approximately $4,700,000.
Mr. Dawkins: All right, Joe, do you want to contradict what he said?
Mr. Joe Longusira: Sorry, I can't tell you anything at this time, I am not
prepared for this. I need to get with Gene Polaez from Public Works who has
all the numbers.
Mr. Plummer: Well, call him.
Mr. Dawkins: Well, call him.
Mr. Longuira: line, we will do it today. We were prepared to do it, Gene was
tomorrow at the Commission 'meeting because it is an item.
Mr. Dawkins: No, no, I need it... OK, wall you can do it tomorrow at the
Commission meting and just...
Mr. Plummer: No, let's do it now and get it out of the way. W we got
another hour.
Mr. Odio: OK, because we...
-.A
Mr. Dawkins: All right, thank you.
Mr. Odio: There are two agenda items tomorrow in relation to that. ON* is
the contract...
Mr. Dawkins' My Coaysissioa has already decided to give you extra smt►ey. 1 40
only justitying to the voters that we hired a consultant who stated the polies ,
Station could be bought in at the present budget, and we are preivi+ii
money than the consultant who we hired.
3v
3i -4
Mr. Pltimmor: Me. no, that is not true. And I've never talked to this son at
oil and I don't know what his... he is saying that it could come in at
SS00,000 lose than that we projected. Did you not say $3,900,0007... and they
ware talking $4,400,000? That's $300,000 loss.
Mr. Longueira: Sir, he can say that all he wants, 0K7... and he can't lose,
because you have already awarded a contract to the contractor for $4,400,000,
OK, so...
Mr. Plummer: No, no, the losers era not us, and not you and not his. The
losers ore the taxpayers who we told $5.000,000, OK? Now, this man is
saying... let mo tell you what he is doing. You are right. We are suckers
and we've boon had, as far as Liberty City Station, but buddy, I don't know
who this guy is, but I am going find out and he is going to be working on that
substation in Little Havana, because if it can be brought in at $3,900,000, I
vast somebody to prove his wrong. That's what I m saying.
Mr. Dawkine: OK, Commissioner Plummer says bring it back and I won't be here,
but bring it back this afternoon.
Mr. Plummer: Bring the other man... who do you want? Mr. Manager, would you
please have that man brought here immediately?
Mr. Odic: To*, sir.
Mr. Plummer: OK, thank you. Mr. Wright, don't run off. I moan, you can have
s seat until Mr. Pelaes gets here.
4. PRESENTATION, CABLES/COMPUTZRS DEPARTMENT.
Mr. Plummer: All right, I'd like to go into Cable, Mr. Manager. Nano, hello,
Cable. Is there anyone here from Cable? Carlos, you got $900,000 plus. What
In the bell do they do for it?
Mr. Carlos Smith: That is the revenue...
Mr. Plummer: No, that is what they spent.
Mr. Smith: Part of that, I believe it is $484,000 gets put back into the
general fund. We are not spending all of that money.
Mr. Plummer: You don't show a transfer.
Mr. Smith: I believe it is in the book, in the notes.
Mr. Plummor: OK, I see it hare. Why is it in Cable you are running in
salaries almost average $60,0007 Average salaries are over $60,000, why?
Mr. Odic: I beliove that includes fringe benefits to. There is an
administrator...
Mr. Plummer: No, all of them are that way.
{
Mr. Smith: No, Sue Smollor to the administrator. I'll give you her salary In
a minute.
Mr. Plummer: You take $303,000 and divide It
by tire, it Is over i60,0001
Mr. Smith: Sue's salary is $56,000.
Mr. Plummer: And she is head.
Mr. Smith: That's right.
Mr. Plummer: Are there mare...
0
Mr. !with: There is a cable engineer who is making $52,000. Two cable
technicians that do the installations for the City and so forth, who wake
.rm.. VX&Mdtel> $26,000 a piece.
Mr. Plu■wer: All right, you can pass over it. I did not see the contribution
to the general fund.
S. PRE=ORATION IT PVRCMASING DIPARTMOR.
-------- ----------- ---- ---�..
Mr. Plussser: Purchasing. What does Purchasing spend $750,000 on? They don't
purchase anything with that money. Why is it $750,000 for Purchasing? What's
the money used for? Where does it go?
IMAVDIILI >ACKGROUND COM INTS NOT INTERED INTO TIM PUBLIC RECORD.
Mr. Plummer: OK, so they buy $225,000. Where does the other $500,000 go?
Mr. Williams: Tou've got the details before you, Commissioner.
Mr. Pluinner: Well, you're basically purchasing, takes in and throws out bids
or RFP's. Why is it $500,000?
Mr. Williams: Let me provide you with the details, Cossaissioner. For ours,
we've got a staff in that department that is nine people, down from ten. As
you well know, we did not replace the chief procurement officer during this
budget year. The big line items Commissioner are, as you know, salaries,
which is again, nine people down from the ten of previous years. The office
supply item, as you already identified, the next item is basically operating
expenses and those are well within the limits of other divisions within the
General Services Administration.
Mr. Plummer: I don't understand $500,000.
Mr. Williams: Mall, salaries...
Mr. Plummer: That number to me is out of proportion.
Mr. Williams: Of that amount, salaries and wages is almost $300,000. Fringe
benefits is another $106,000.
Mr. Plusme r: Why nine positions?
Mr. Williams: Tou must remember, Commissioner, this office does all of the
both informal and formal bidding for the entire City. I mean that involves a
tremendous amount of documents that have to be prepared and sent out for
various bids.
Mr. Pluomaer: That's five percent of our budget.
Mr. Williams: What's five percent of your budget?
Mr. Plummer: Almost $1.000,000 to run Purchasing.
Mr. Williams: $749,000, yes.
Mr. Plummer: And you feel that that is justified?
Mr. Willisma: Well, Commissioner, including the tact that within that somat,
that budget is absorbing all of the office supplies and smateriale ter tjM
entire City.
,.r
Mr. Plunsmrr: That is $225,000, we know that.
Mr. Willisis: OK, and than you've got three buyers, which these peep10 a&I"
a tremendous coanodity load based on the amsasing smowmt of pur h"# *g4e
that are issued each year. Then you've got again, a ro*nod dNMt
operating expenses. The budget is down from last year, 13 percent. ~'
40
Mr. Plmsnor: Tom It ow, that is set what I vast to hear. You know, ghat I
vast to beer is, that we are trying to reduce and cut it down, and we are
•ura.uS on it.
Mr. Millismat We have this year reduced it by 13 percent, Commissioner. We
have reduced it by $111,000 from this current fiscal year.
Mr. Plusmor: You've got a long way to go.
Mr. Williams: Mall, in those areas that we are able to reduce it further, we
will. One of the things that we are very excited about and we are working
with the Department of Computers on, is a way to standardise more of the
commodities that are bought throughout the City. That standardization will
give us the opportunity to primarily issue for fewer purchase orders.
Mr. Plummert Mr. Manager, miscellaneous revenues, down from $1,500,000 to
$200,000.
Mr. Suranat Comaisoioner, we have reclassified most of those miscellaneous
rovenuos to proper line item revenues.
Mr. Plummets to they are included in the individual budgets?
Mr. Srana: Tao, sir.
6. A - DISCUSSION CONCERNING POLICE GUARDS; B - DISCUSSION CONCERNING
REVENUE FROM SCHOOL BOARD FOR USE OF CITY PARKS.
Mr. Plummer: Mr. Manager, why the doubling of the costs of school guards?...
which I have always said should be paid by the School Board In the first
place.
Mr. Srana: They are paying. We are getting the revenues as school guards.
Mr. Plummer: Nov such revenue are we getting?
Mr. Burma: $160,000.
INAUDIBLE BACKGROUND COMMENTS NOT XNTFMD INTO THE PUBLIC RIOUllD.
Mr. Odio: Nov such do they get?
Mr. Plummer: Wall, excuse me now. You are showing last year $120,000. Does
that mean that you are doubling the amount of guards?
Mr. Odio: We are doubling the revenue, according to this.
Mr. Plum rt That is not my question.
Mr. Odiot They are not doubling the guards.
Mr. Plum r: We are not?
Mr. Odio: We are getting sere...
Mr. Plummets Why are we doubling the revenue?
4
Mr. Odle: We are getting more... we are c
�'i�g tbir Caro ter fiat t:
Mr. surana: They required 30 guards. $160,000. F ,
Mr. Odio: Do you have a bV64kdown thortt
Mr. Srana: We are increasing guards.
Mr. Plus r: Nobody knows. ,.
R
Mr. Odio: According to the projeetion is that we are getting more percentage
out of the fines that they are collecting.
Mr. Duress: We are increasing the guards.
Mr. Plummer: Nov such revenue are we getting out of the School board for the
use of the parks?
Mr. Olio: It !stresses every year. The first year was $150,000 and it
increases every year.
Mr. Durana: About three hundred thousand something. Now such do you got
budgeted?
INAUDIBLE BACKGROUND COMMZNTS NOT ENTERED INTO THE PUBLIC RECORD.
Mr. Odio: Three eighty three.
Mr. Duran*: Three eighty.
Mr. Plummer: Did I lose my colleagues? Hello? I feel like the Lone hanger.
Well, Dawkins is here. Is there anything else that you want to touch on?
Mr. Dawkins: Well, I think we need to do our budget.
Mr. Plummer: All right, I want to get... the only other real budget I want
to do is community development. I've not received the document that I asked
for yesterday, so I can't really speak to it this morning. Conventions I want
to get into, because it's $10,000,000, but I understand that Jorge wanted to
talk... all right, go ahead, Jorge.
7. LAW DEPARTMENT PRESENTATION.
Mr. Fernandez: I just want to sake sure that I have a budget, that's all I
really want to know.
Mr. Fernandez: What do you need?
Mr. Dawkins: I need to know what you are going to do about outside
counseling. I need to know what you are going to do for in-house training for
your staff, who does not have the expertise that you night desire it to have
to be able to serve the City of Miami and those kind of things, that is what I
need to know.
Mr. Fernandez: Right, certainly. We have embarked on a rather ambitious
project of restructuring the staff at the Law Department. We have in the
process eliminated a position at the top, that is a deputy -ship has been
eliminated. We have also proposed to hire, whenever possible newer attorneys,
or attorneys with less experience for purposes of training them. To that and
we also want to...
Mr. Dawkins: Hold it now. Nov, when you hire attorneys with, using your
words, lose experience, as a training ground, are you really and truly being
fair to us when you era telling me that when a case presents itself that you
are going to have an experienced person, and an inexperienced person in it,
that that will serve the purpose?
Mr. Fernandez: Well, what I am saying Commissioner, is that we vast to be
able to maintain the level of expertise that we have achieved and developed ip
the Law Department by retaining the very good, competent counsel that we bave.
We also want, whenever necessary, to attract an hire attorneys with euffiaieat
.
f
expertise to be able to assist us, but we also have budgetary constralats agd
we are aware that there is only one source of fundiag for our departwat,
which is general revenue and to that extent, we are mindful of the tact titst
we need to address the needs of the Law Department with a budget samateaae.
Mr. Dawkins: OK.
r ,
Ya
�°
��
42
Mr. Fernandes: We want to... it is very important to us, especially in light
of the fact that as of late, the complexity and the number of cases that are
being filed against the City is increasing, that we retain, and that whenever
necessary, we hire in-house counsel that have expertise in all of these areas.
An example of that is in the area of labor relations. Recently we went out
and hired an attorney, a woman attorney, who has tan years of experience in
the area of labor relations. This was one area where we felt that the Law
Department needed to provide the City with that kind of expertise and
eomp*tency, so in areas where we feel that the City needs expert
representation, we will hire at that level. We also want to be able to retain
the attorneys that we have had aboard for five, six, seven years, that have
really developed the experience with us, so that they can continue providing
us quality service. We are comaitt*d to the Comalesion'a mandate to us, of
reducing outside counsel to the greatest degree possible and in doing so, we
want to hire, as I said before, attorneys that we can bring in and train them,
train them with senior attorneys that we already have in staff, and also
aroma -train them. What we are finding out, Comaissioner Dawkins, is that we
have a sumbar of attorneys that have already bean with us for two and three
years, that are ready to get into areas of more difficulty. Training and
preparation for them is crucial, that's why we are requiring in our budget,
*van though our budget is for the same amount as it was last year, that we
consider more continuing legal education for the in-house attorneys that we
have.
Mr. Dawkins: OK, I'll sloop on it, J.L., and we'll think about his budget
tomorrow.
Mr. Plummer: Are you asking us for an increase?
Mr. Fernandez: No, we're not, Commissioner.
Mr. Pluma*r: Are you asking us for a d*crease?
Mr. Fernandez: No, we or* coming to you with the same level of funding as we
did last year, as it is found at page 81.
Mr. Plummer: Then why did you want to talk?
Mr. Fernandez: I don't. I don't want to talk.
Mr. Plummer: Tou should have said, I'm happy, period, meant
Mr. Fernandez: That is what I said, I was responding to Commissioner Dawkins'
question.
Mr. Plummer: It took you an awful long time to say I an happy, meant
Mr. Fernandez: I'■ vary happy. But the issue of in-house, of trying to
eliminate outside counsel fees is an important issue to the Commission.
Mr. Plummer: He who has himself for an attorney...
Mr. Fernandez: Is a big fool.
Mr. Plummer: H* who has himself for a budget director, as an attorney... yes,
OK. Anything else?
Mr. F*rnandas: No.
Mr. Plummer: We'll sloop on it.
h A
43
N
„ Ek.
c `1
7
4 c
.. c
• . (A) PRESENTATION by f6V"P ar-an"b wnu "uN vtNT I ONS MIARTMUIT (a)
DI=CUSSION Of COCONUT GROVE VCHIRITION CEMTER RENOVATION.
---
---------------------------------------------------------
Mr. llussser: Conventions. Go ahead, Tony.
Mr. Tony 1•ajarea t Cossiissioner, our request this year for our budget is
$9,290,000, which is approximately 13 percent less than last year. That's
Minly due to two factors. One is the refinancing of the bonds, which you
Initiated about a year and one-half ago, and which will result this year in a
projectad deficit of $1,600,000, for the first time in this building.
Mr. llussser: Now much of the $9,000,000 goes to pay off the debt?
Mr. lajares: With the refinancing, about $3,400,000, or about $3,100,000.
Mr. llussser: Is that decreasing every year?
Mr. lajares: Carlos would have to answer that, but I believe we took the
$900.000 saving off this year. I'd like to point out that...
Mr. llumser: That was due to the refinancing.
Mr. lajares: That is correct, yes, sir.
Mr. llumsmer: What I an asking is, is the revenues from which we get our
percentage going up in revenue back to us, or is it constant? Are we losing?
Where are wet
Mr. lajares: Nano, do you want to answer that. I believe you took it all off
this year, the savings, right?
Mr. Surana: Are you talking about refinancing?
Mr. llummmer: No, I am talking about, you know, there was the day projected
where we would break even and no subsidy would have to be for payment of the
bonds. Nov, are we every year doing better, are we doing worse?
Mr. lajares: No, let ma explain to you where we are. Three years ago when we
consolidated the Convention bureau and this department, our deficit was
approximately $4,900,000. The actual, without the refinancing of the bonds,
we have the deficit now, of about $2,300,000, $2,500,000. That's the real
deficit now in this department.
Mr. llumsmer: OK, so $3,000,000 went there. Where did the other $6,000,000
go?
Mr. lajares: What other $6,000,000?
Mr. Plummer: You have $9,000,000 in budget.
Mr. lajares: Oh, that's revenues and expenses. The contractual...
Mr.
Plummer:
Where did it go?
Mr.
lej ares:
OK, it goes to pay off the garage.
Mr.
llmmer:
And that is how much?
,{N
Mr.
Eigfried lspso: $820,000.
Mr.
lajares:
$420,000.
T
k
Mr.
llusseer:
That's $4,000,000.
Mr.
tspoo:
1 M G is three point...
rY {
-
Mr.
lajarosf
is tkroe
! M • pout •kstt
F 1
w
fx f s
'4 L
Mr.
Espoo:
Two point two.
Mr.
Pajares:
Two point two.
Mr.
Plummer:
Wait a minute, gait a miautel F M a is a management consultant
only?
Mr.
Pajares:: No, F M B actually manages this building and we appropriate
funds for them to manage the building, and they pay the expenses of the
building.
Mr.
Plummer:
Excuse me, what expenses do they pay?
Mr.
Pajares::
All the supplies, the electricity, they have the entire
expenses of
the building.
Mr.
Plummer:
F M 0 pays all of the expenses of the building? They pay the
air
conditioning,
electric, and what do they Pet as their managerial feet
Mr.
Pajares:
$IS0,000 a year, more or less.
Mr.
Plummer:
OK, so they are two point what?
Mr.
Pajares:
two point two this year.
Mr.
Plummer:
OK, so that's $6,000,000? Where is the other three?
Mr.
Pajares:
There's the depreciation expense. Also back to the same,
depreciation
expense.
Mr.
Bursas:
He has a breakdown.
Mr.
Pajares:
by the way, debt service is 3.481.
Mr.
Plummer:
OK, w* are still in the ball park. Now much depreciation do you
show?
Mr.
Pajares:
$1,670,000.
Mr.
Plummer:
We are down to $2,500,000. Where is the other $2,S00,000 go?
Mr.
Bursae:
Conference Center, so on, Convention bureau.
F
Mr.
Pajares:
Well, taxes...
Mr.
Plummer:
Taxes on what?
Mr.
Pajares:
Taxes on the building. We are assessed a special tax for the...
Mr.
Odio: Tony, I sm sorry, did you...
Mr.
Plmsmwer:
Whoa, whoa! We are assessed at taxes for what? - a City owned
building?
Mr.
Pajares:
For the people mover.
Mr.
Plummer:
Oh, OK, no, we agreed to that.
Mr.
Odlo: Tes,
tad the other thing, we have $018,000... Tony, =g1g,0O0... §
Mr.
Pajares:
Tog, I just said that.
Mr.
Odio: H�
$816,536 for the managsm st of the parking gars#*, elf
parking.
Mr.
Pajares:
Too, he had that. ,
(
Mr.
Plmmmsrm
We had that. We got that in there. '
Mr.
Pauses:
the rest is expena*s. coNmsiasl""r. iM hape +
which
it Ilk*
SIX hundred and... w111 give you the test tom.
;t r
Mr. Plw r: Of that $9,000,000...
Mr. Pajarea: $591,000, $600,000.
Mr. Pluameers Of that $9,000,000, how such comes from general fund?
Mr. Pajares: One point six would be the
Mr. Piumeer: One point six? And where does the rest come from?
Mr. Pajores: We just went through the whole thing. You were down to two
point five.
Mr. Plummer: The revenue? Ve hadn't even talked about revenue, so we didn't
go through it.
Mr. Odlo: ghow his the revenues.
Mr. Pajareat Do you want me to read than all to you, sir?
Mr. Plummort No, no, just tell me, what was the revenue side of the coin?
Mr. Pajores: OK.
Mr. Plummer: Now such revenue did this structure produce to the City?
Mr. Tajares: Now such revenue?
Mr. Plummer: Teo.
Mr. Odio: Teo.
Mr. Pajares: It has to be balanced. We have a deficit, well, it is very
simple. Teo, you take the deficit, it is one point six.
Mr. Odio: Tony give him the numbers.
Mr. Plummer: You are saying than, that this structure brought in revenues to
the City of $7,500,000, roughly?
Mr. Pajares: That's correct. That is our projected revenues. Then we make
the deficit of one point six from the utility service tax.
Mr. Plummer: I would ask you to send me a breakdown of how that S7,SOO,000
revenue cams to the City, and from where.
Mr. Odlo: Give it to him now.
Mr. Pajaress Tea, sir. I can give it to you now.
Mr. Plummer: And of that $1,600,000 that you get from the City, how much
actually comes from the general fund?
Mr. Odios All of it.
Mr. lajarest No. it cones from the utility service taxes, sm I comet?
Mr. Odio: Whatever it comes from, it tosses from the general fund, sir.
f i I
Mr. Plummer: Are you saying then the TDC goes into the general fund to s
out to his? ..s
a x cy"
Mr. Odle: No, the $1,600,080 is a deficit. ,
Mr. llwmmor: I understand that. - 4
Mr. Odio: And we Aays to Cover with general fwW Vwgoj►
s�
Mr. liwmmsr: Oft. Mere is the YDC woney shown is f►l6:.
to f { s
Mr. OMiee Ilwy $to Nieg to pay for aw $hies totem Is 08. h'
t
ON
Mr. Pajarest That's part of the revenues.
Co missioner, It Is also of the expenses.
Mr. Odio: The $7,500,000...
Mr. Plummer: OK...
Mr. Odlo: ... that includes...
It is part of the revenues,
Mr. Plusmert Now such are you taking from TDC fund for the operation of your
shop?
Mr. Pajares: gin twenty one, or something like that.
Mr. Plumsar: And the rest of the money, where does it go?
Mr. Odio: It goes to the Orange cowl, and the other projects, do you want se
to list?
Mr. Burana: Grand Prix.
Mr. Odic: . OK.
Mr. Plummer: No, I'd like to aee it, I would...
Mr. Pajares: Comissioner, that's ZO percent for the Orange Bowl renovation,
and if you remember, we Dade a deal that it would go to fund part...
Mr. Plummer: Tony, I know that better than you do. The Question I m asking
is, if you are using basically half of it for your shop, I'd like to see where
the other half is going. That's all I am asking.
Mr. Odic: Mall, it is not... the saximum we have collected is one point two,
we have covered the Grand Prix...
Mr. Plummer: I'd like to see it, you can send me a now on it. OK, thank you,
sir. Just for purposes of bringing this thing to a conclusion, anything need
to be said on the Grove Rxhibition7
Mr. Odic: I have not signed a contract yet for the renovation, I m having
some problems with the contractor who listed his subcontractors and he is now
trying to tell m that they are not the same, so it sight come to a point that
I would have to reject the bid and then we will have to sake arrangements for
the ASTA convention to go to another center.
9. COMMENTS ON VACANCIRS i ARTHUR BROOKS LATOFV.
Mr. Dawkins: Hold it. before you leave.
Mr. Plumsar: Wait a minute.
Mr. Dsvkios: No, no, not you, I need the Manages. Oh, yes, I do. ,we
noticed noticed the makeup of your staff dad i also know ou of
y g sous vacancioa. I
know you'll be addressing that.
Mr. Pajares: Yes, sir.
H
Mr. Dawkins: Thank you, air. Also, Mr. Manager, I've noticed...I'n tlisow It
'
with you. I'm talking to the manager now - before, owdry tiws I yol lod sod
t.
stressed, we Caws with one, sad me of those was Mr. Arthur Brooks, whs w�a
stuck in a position that was not in his field of sudeswor, oo ptSON of
-.J
crunch, he was let go, sad i've sat by w#teAiag, to own if be would bo bx*"Ot
back into the area where he has a xpertia, so I weuld hops th+tt
fill positions, that wre Might he 444a to go got &s abody wltb tho SpOM
and what have you, is that area. I don't know what his ores so.
Mr. Wi0s I don't either. I'll try to low "t forr, ,
w.
i
4i
Mr. Dawkins: All right, wall be has a degree. The degree says he hen
sametrnang.. .
Mr. Odio: Tao, air.
Mr. Odio: .... although I don't know ghat it is in, but if it " in
tidleyvinks. and we need a tidleywinks operator, than he is qualified, OR?
10. A - PRESENTATION BY INTERNAL AUDITS i REVIEWS. S - BRIEF CO MEMTS ON
BUDGET DEPARTMENT, OFFICE OF THE CITY MANAGER, CITY CLERK AMD BOARD OF
COMMISSIONERS.
Mr. Plummer: Internal Audits. Now come it is so slow?
Dr. Hattie Desielo: Are you speaking about something specific?
Mr. Plummer: No, I'■ talking about in general.
Dr. Daniela: Well. for one thing, we are very short handed, Commissioner;
however we've taken some steps to address...
Mr. Odlo: She spent the whole year trying with the Cuban Museum, that's why
she is short handed. She slight be even shorter after we finish it.
Dr. Daniels: We've taken some steps to address that. In the past we had only
five auditors. We are moving toward being able to do soma auditing through
the computer. We've hired an EDP auditor. The City Manager has also approved
hiring an additional auditor. Some of the grant contracts we will be
contracting outs therefore, we believe that we can complete additional audits
at a such rapid pace.
Mr. Plu+mmerc Mr. Manager, you know, down the line here, we are going to get
over the budget. Budget, I understand, is very crucial in the month of
September, and a few months other than that. Now you have auditors in the
Budget Department. You know, let me tall you...
Mr. Odio: No, we don't, Commissioner.
Mr. Plummer: OK, look, the problem that I see is this. Whenever you have a
scandal, is because people are not aware of what's going on. Audits need to
be done timely, and in my estimation, Mr. Manager, and I think in your own,
audits are not anywhere as quick as they should be. Now, I am saying to you
In my estimation, if we are going to try to keep down problems, I cannot
accept the excuse of any kind) Nov, I need to know, what are we going to do,
or what can we do to get into a posture where these audits are going to be
timely, and I don't mean to pick, but I've got to use one example, the
Budweiser Race, which I an involved with I got a completed audit for 187-088,
one week after the '88-'69 race, a year and a weak, it took to complete the
audit. Now, I an not saying whose fault that is, I am not picking on you, but
I think it is the classic example that these things are allowed to continue
and you ore not putting more money into this department. Now, Mr. Manager,
people are money, money are people, I may that you've got to have more,
whatever it takes to where we can cone up with timely audits.
Mr.
Odio: What we are doing, I think you are going to see it,
Ip't
remember, we have a hundred items, if it is tomorrow that we are secosNlslwdg
as
outside firm to do more audits for us. I vast a balance of outside firm
and
City employees.
Mr.
Plummmer: I think that's very good.
Mr.
Odio: And the item on tomorrow, 1 forest...
Dr.
Daniels: TOO, it's on tomorrow's •gouda.
Mr.
Odio: it is on tomorrow, and we are rsccl odjng tbo g4M Mot
doing audits fog us, and they v111 bevo to do it, to a Uwifolvw.
� ' "
Mr. Plummer: Mow many audits do you do a pear?
Dr. Daniels: We have on a master list, over 400, and we usually complete ISO,
but we are projecting this year...
Mr. Plummer: Wait, excuse me, whoa. What happens to the other ISO?
Dr. Dasiela: OK, those are usually, I would sap of minor importance, things
that can be done every two years or so, not necessarily that they are done
each year, but, what we arm projecting this year is that we will coswlete an
additional SO percent of those and then the grand audits will basically be
contracted out so that 100 percent of everything will be done. In response to
the audit that you asked about, that was completed, that was in Juno. That
audit is basically complete, and you should have that very shortly.
Mr. Plummer: Hattie, I didn't man to pick on the one, it's the one that I
knew the best, OK? I'm not saying who is at fault, I'm saying there is a
problem, and that problem is that audits are not being done timely enough.
Mr. Manager, may I suggest to you, since we have a policy that in any monies
that are given in grants by this City, an audit is to be done, they should pay
for that out of the monies of the grant, OK?
Mr. Surana: $75,000.
Mr. Odio: That's where we are going. That's where we are going.
Mr. Plummer: OK.
Mr. Surana: There is $75,000 revenue.
Mr. Odio: We are putting $75.000 already in revenues for that, but I'd like
to...
Mr. Plummer: Well, it is not a revenual
Mr. Odlo: Well,
Mr. Surana: They are to pay it to us.
Dr. Daniels: No, that is what has boon done in this particular budget. Tou
will notice one of our line items is $100,000 for outside audits of grants,
and that will also be provided in term of being...
Mr. Plummer: But that is a wash, it's not as revenue.
Dr. Daniels: No.
Mr. Odio: But I think, Commissioner, and I'd like to gat you a manio that we
wrote on what the department is going to be doing, is more than the audits we
were doing before they were... I think we ware wasting a lot of time. For
instance, I'll give you an example of what I'd like to do is what we did
Saturday at the Orange &owl, where we moved in at about 10:00 o'clock at night
sad the parking lot was closed and the cars were counted, and I me waiting for
the count. I know what is going to happen. In other words, that is the type
of audits I'd like to do more of, and...
Mr. Plummer: OK, but Mr. Manager, if in fact she is saying that bar budget is
so more people this year than what she had last year, the outside auditors are
either going to be damn expensive... the question I sm asking is budget time.
Should we seriously consider increasing this department to a point where it
a
can give timely audits?
Mr. Odlo: No, because we also bays the Office of Managesent Audit now, that
r
is going to audit, for Instance, the Off -Street larking Authority, that wain
fF`
auditing, nor complete. We are also auditing the all the tan o, the PVM�Oty
taxes, and all the taxes that come from the County. Wore doing that Mw tW-1
time, and they are also working on the pension, on the funded part of the
so we have taken some, responsibilities away, plus the outs %
contractors, I think they are sufficient.
Mr. Plummer: I'• going to continua to watch it, I west you to haw.
49 r'
Mr. Odiot Teo, sir.
Mr. Plummart City Clerk, do you have asything to say?
Mr. Dawkinst No, I page her budget. the's alright.
Mr. Plummert Law Department we have taken. Budget Department?
Mr. lurana: I seed two million more.
Mr. Plummart They want $2,000,000, do you think we ought to give it to them?
Mr. Odio: Too.
Mr. Plummer: The Budget Department.
Mr. Odiot Tea, and then I will hire another budget director.
Mr. Plummart Cut them by $2,000,0001 All right, City Manager.
Mr. Odic: We have two...
Mr. Plummer: No, so, you get up to that microphone...
Mr. Odio: Yell, I need more money.
Mr. Plummer: ... and justify every damn dollar.
Mr. Odio: Let me see. Wall, I'■ down one position.
Mr. Plummer: Mentally, or physically?
Mr. Plummer: My budget is the saws. It is about $1,000 lower, $19,000 lower
than... I have reduced $19,454, exactly, from the budget, so it is one percent
less.
Mr. Plummer: Are you happy with your budget?
Mr. Odio: No, I an concerned, eventually, as we go to, hope next year to soro
based budget is that, Commissioner, we have to find a solution for the
executives who have not received an increase in pay for the last... since I
have been City Manager.
Mr. Plummer: Why do you bring that up this year?
Mr. Odlo: because, I
Mr. Plumsr: Tau just wrote tomorrow's headlines.
Mr. Odiot No, no, I sm not bringing it up since he's gone. Vhat I really
want to discuss eventually and bring back, if you authorise it, is the bonus
system, or incentive system, in lieu of salary increases, because the
unions...
Mr. Plummers board of Commissioners, who is going to present this City
Commission's budget?
Mr. Odio: It's too high. ate,
UNINWITIRD sP&AKIR: The Manager.
Mr. Plummar s The Manager.
Mr. suraaat gam as last year, no shows. ;k
Mr. Odios The City Casmission budget did not sh"s at W. It to the dM" 40 tt'
last year and T eoogratulsto oil of you for belag`geed wsnagoss,
Mr. Plummer: Now COW 1t show me :with four rapjoyeosl
Mr. Odic: W11, you !tows four positions.
{
a.,y
Mr. burana: That is ghat you budgeted.
Mr. olio: to that is why you always had a fund balance.
Mr. Plummer: but, wait a ■inutel
Mr. Odio: Now we just take the savings of...
Mr. Plusmar: If the Chief of Police is doing the recruiting for sty office,
and I've tot two employees, but I don't have four, but I want to get them in
for the schooling.
Mr. Odio: Well, good, you can hire them.
Mr. Plunwer: The natural attrition in my office, the average age is decessedl
Mr. Odio: I hope Joan Klein is not listening to this.
Mr. Dawkins: Mall. you wait until I tell Joan you are talking about here.
Mr. Odio: That's right.
Mr. Plummer: Everybody should have a yenta. The Mayor's office.
Mr. Odio: The same as last year, exactly the sane amount.
11. DISCUSSION ON SPORTS AUTHORITY BUDGET.
Mr. Plummer: OK, is there anybody hers who wishes to say anything that hasn't
been covered? Mr. Manager, I am concerned in three areas that we've not
covered, and not in this workshop. One is the Sports Authority budget. Where
Is it?
Mr. Odio: Well, that doesn't come here to workshops. It is presented... ',
Mr. Plummer: It's part of the budget we've got to approve.
°=6
Mr. Odio: No, sir. It is separate from our budget.
Mr. Plummar: but we still approve that at budget time in the safe time
frames.
Mr. Odio: I think you are entitled to ask the chairman... well, I will ask
the Sports Authority director...
Mr. Plussu r: Zxcuse me, we are having public hearings on Friday night.
That's two days from now. Has anybody seen the budget for the Sports
Authority?
Mr. Odio: No. I have not.
Mr. Musser: Nano?
Mr.
Surana:
No, air.
Mr.
Plummer:
Dawkins?
Mr.
Dawkins:
No.
Mr.
Plummer:
Nobody has
seen their budget. Are they
sebedulod to
budget reviewed by the Commission on Friday •igbtt
Mr.
Odlo: I
bave not seen them in the agenda at all.'`
ti iR .k: y
Mr.
Plummer:
me
Wall, wben
do We that budget?
-• ate' ��,
t
t..fix Y 7
1� 1
Mr. Odie: I think they might sot be running through September 20th. That's
ghat I want to check, if you allow us. Let me check the budget for the Sports
Autnority, because I don't know if they are running is the saw tins frame
that we are. I'll have to check that out.
(INAUDIBLE STATEMENT)
Mr. Odio: I agree, and I haven't soon it.
12. DISCUSSION ON INTERNATIONAL TRADE BUDGET.
Mr. Plummier: International Trade budget.
Mr. Odio: OK, it is here, I put a copy in front of you, I believe.
Mr. tluasaart We just got it today.
Mr. Odio: Today.
Mr. llusner: And they expect us to boar it and understand it on Friday sight.
Is that correct?
Mr. Odio: Well, if you approve... I guess what I am going to say is this, and
I could be wrong. If you approve the City...
Mr. llunner: International Trade for $500,000.
Mr. Odio: No, if you approve the City budget, you will be approving this.
(INAUDIBLE STATEMENT)
Mr. Plummer: Well, this is the first today, that I received a breakdown* and
you are talking about total personnel only alone in that department of
$221,000.
Mr. Odio: Yes, and these are not new people, Commissioner. These are
transfers from Development and they were doing the ear functions under
Development.
Mr. Plummer: The question that I have, the basic question with International
Trade - we the Commission are turning over $525,000 of tax money. Are they
bound by any way to answer as we are?
Mr. Odio: Well you, they answer to you, to the Commission. The difference
here now, that this board will answer to you and not to the City Manager, as I
understand it. As I wrong there?
Mr. llunmer: I don't know, I m asking.
Mr. Odio: No, the way I understand it is, the board now, once you allocate
those funds, will report directly to the City Commission and with a
representative of Comaaissioner Dawkins in that board. They would have to come
to you to add or to delete any funds from here.
f Fl.
P
13. DISCUSSION CO BUDUT 92DUCTIONS OF THE NORTM POLICI SUBSTATION.
--------.y_���—_----- ------------------- ------------------- -----
Mr. Plummer: Move we got the son from Public Yorks about the police station?
Mr. Odio: Is Dens palest here yet? If Lather is coming, we will be here
forever.
Mr. plumwer: Well, that isn't who they asked for, they asked for Palest.
THRRIUPON THIS NUDGE-1 WORKSHOP WAS RICISSID AT 11:35
A.M. AND RSCONVIMED AT 11:SO A.M.
Mr. Plummer: Mr. Wright, once again, if you would, just identify yourself asd
your qualifications and who you were hired by. Is this your chart that we are
looking at?
Mr. idward C. Wright: No, this In the Public Works chart.
Mr. Plummer: OK.
Mr. Wright: My same is Idward C. Wright, architect, president of Wright,
Rodriguez and Schindler, Architects. I was hired by the City to do the value
engineering on the north district police substation.
Mr. Plummer: You were hired when?
Mr. Wright: I was hired during the mid part of past year, 1957.
Mr. Plummer: Go ahead.
Mr. Wright: We were hired to value engineer and fast .rack the project. It
came in at an original bid of $5,300,000 and we were asked to bring it down to
approximately $4,400,000.
Mr. Plummer: Correct.
Mr. Wright: In order to assess whether or not we were getting the kinds of
credit that we thought we should have back from the contractor, we asked ae
independent consultant, independent estimating consultant to come in and sake
a comparison between the original drawings and the value engineer's drawing
and tell us what the cost difference would be.
Mr. Plummer: Who was the consultant that you used?
Mr. Wright: The consultant was a person that we had talked with the City
about, that was familiar with the project. I have his name here.
Mr. Plummer: Why don't you go to the podium. I think it would help
everybody.
Mr. Wright: The consultant's name was Bill Hendry.
Mr. Plummer: Bill Mondry?
Mr. Wright: Tos. We asked his because he had...
Mr. Plummer: Is he an architect?
Mr. Wright: No, he is a professional estimating consultant.
(INAUDISLt STATMONT)
Mr. Wright: Too.
r-
fi
Mr. Plumsort OK. rt
Mr. Wright: As I us* saying before, the rein Mini llrs`` �*
isiportant to get his, beceuss osse the credits = began is
$3
contractor, we would have to have some kind of comparison to slake sure that we
were getting the kind of credit back that we needed. His estimate for the
.� -ct talking about furniture, inventory, things of that
sort, just construction of the building, indicated that we should have a net
deduct of $1,400,000.
Mr. Plummer: lased on the figure of five point something?
Mr. Wright Subjecting the one point four from the five point three, would
equal approximately three point nine million dollars.
Mr. Plummer: Where were those deducted from, approximately?
Mr. Wright: Wall, one of the major deducts was from eliminating the parking
under the building. That was a major deduct, and everything related to that,
the sprinklers, the exhaust systems. We went ahead and did other value
engineering things also, such as changing the skin on the building,
redesigning the structural system in the building and things of that sort.
Mr. Plummer: OK, go ahead.
Mr. Wrights Well, I think what actually happened is that every one here, the
satire team, including the City and the Police Department is interested in
bringing this thing in on budget and everyone has made a concerted effort to
do that. I think that what is happened was that when the station went out, it
came back at $5,300,000. Our estimators telling us that there was a lot of
fluff in there, around $400,000.
Mr. Plummer: Fluff of $400,0007
Mr. Wright: Tea.
Mr. Plummer: Fluff is a buffer?
Mr. Wrights Teo, buffer. The City negotiated for $3,300,000 down to
$4.400,000, which was a savings to the City of $1,000,000, approximately
$900,000. At that particular time, when they had gotten to that figure, there
was a lot of pressure to get this station started. It was election time, the
Miami Herald was there every day. Everyone wanted to see the station get
started right away. The City was in a position, they had saved approximately
$1.000,000 out of the $5.300,000, but I think that if we could have waited
just a little longer to gat my estimate back, than went in and negotiated with
the contractor, I think we would have been in bettor shape.
Mr. Plummer: OK, who is next?
Mr. Don Cathert I'd like to sake one consent, make it quite clear. The
$900,000 that is put out as a savings on this contract, in my opinion, has to
be looked at with a certain, a different view. What we did, we eliminated the
parking garage, so we didn't actually change anything in the plan, other than
eliminate a portion of the building, which would naturally save us $1,000,000.
Mr. Plummer: Yes, but he's talking about, Don, an additional $500,000. He is
talking about $3,900,000.
Mr. Cather: That's correct. Now, I don't know where he can save that money,
but if he can, it's small.
Mr. Plummer: Well, the parking garage, he said, was taken out of the
$1,000,000. Well, lot so ask this question - beyond the $4,400,000, where do
you find the additional $500,000 savings, beyond that which reduced it to the
$4,400,000.
Mr. Cathert Wall, first of all, let as ask another question. Nov such did we
sane net on the elimination of the piling?
Mr. Wright: Approximately $90.000 to $93,000 on the pilings. Otbsr than...
Mr. Dawkins' (FIRST PART OF STATIMENT NOT PLACID IMTO 2W PURLIC )...
nitpick, how many such instances of where you could save little pesfy ants
money like this, with $19,000, and maybe $55,000, or N,000 &W $2000007 IiW
many of those did you find?
4
Mr. Wright: I would say at least iS to 30.
Mr. Dawkins. All right, thank you. Go ahead now. Let's just don't nitpick
ea one.
Mr. plu ser: My question still remains the Basic and I as► talking now in the
broad terminology. They reduced and negotioted down frogs $S,300,000 to
$4,400,000. you are stating that if they had further, they could hove &one to
$3,900,000.
Mr. Wright. But, ace, they didn't know that at that time, because the
estimate was not in place at that time. The estimate was not in place at that
time.
Mr. Plu■mer: The question I ma asking is, what are you saying, where does the
additional $500,000 in savings that you say, what were they? - beyond the
$900,000 drop.
Mr. Wrights Well, it is a combination of the underground parking, everything
related to it, the changing of the skin on the building, the elimination of a
skylight, and maybe tan to fifteen thousand smaller items, like $14,000 here,
$10,000, $5,000 there. Nov, these estimates that I have here, which indicate
the $3,900,000 figure, compared with the $4,400,000 figure, my professional
opinion is that it is going to fall somewhere between the two. Now, there is
a contingency in there, and enough retention in the project that should bring
It in at the four point, anywhere between the $3,900,000 and the $4,400,000.
Mr. Dawkins: Well, are you saying sir...
Mr. Plusaer: Well, that's not the case. They are already telling us that in
the north substation, that they are $147,000 over the five.
Mr. Dawkins: Are you saying, air, that the reason they are $140,000 over is
that when we hired you as a consultant, to attempt to bring the cost down,
that we did not wait for your figures and for you to produce that that we
hired, before they went ahead and signed a contract, is that what you are
saying? Or what are you saying?
Mr. Wright: Yes, that is exactly what I am saying.
Mr. Plummer: Wall, the question is, why didn't they?
Mr. Wright: Well, they did it because there was a tressandous amount of
pressure on thews to gat this station started.
Mr. Dawkins: No, you don't know why they did it. Tou didn't do it, so don't
try to slake no explanation why they did it, you didn't do it.
Mr. Wright: Well, he asked se.
Mr. Dawkins: OK, then.
Mr. Plummo rs Nov, look, as far as I as concerned, we've been had, OKI We've
been had for 4500,000. Are you hired to do the appraisal on the south?
Mr. Wright: No, I'■ not.
Mr. Plummer: Has anybody been hired to do the appraisal on the south?
(INAUDIBLE STATEMENT)
Mr. Plummer: Outside, or inside? a, }
INAUDIUS UMORORMD COMMMS MOT in TERED INTO THE "MLIC RECORD. b _.
Mr. llummBrs Mo, I mast an independent. I want an independent. Mr. wit,
I will present at tomorrow's meeting, that this gentleman be bl"d. I difrd<}t
think we have to So...
IMAUDISU DACKGROM CCNND= NOT MITERED IMTO TNX MLIC A. °
DB
f s
•
Mr. tlummor: Me is an appraiser.
Mr. Dawkina: No, he is an architect.
Mr. Wright: no, I sm set architect.
Mr. Dwkiner That's right, hold it.
Tau keep... stay out of this.
Mr. pluaners If he did this Mork in the last station, I want him to do the
sane job on the other station, OKI now, he might be an architect, and ha
sight be...
Mr. Dwkinat he has to go out and hire one twenty consultant. As a
professional, that is what he has to do.
Mr. Wright: May I say some things, pleas*.
Mr. llunear: Our*.
Mr. Wrightt We are continually doing value engineering on the station. At
this point, everyone has agreed, and we haw* documentation that over $600,000
has bets returned to us. We are not...
Mr. tlummo rt $600.000 for what, and where?
Mr. Wright: 0600,000 from the $5,300.000 has been returned back to us.
Mr. Plummer: Tou mean reduced, it has not been returned.
Mr. Wright: Reduced. We have been credited for that amount.
Mr. Plummer: but I thought that was supposed to be $900,000. I thought it
was supposed to be from...
Mr. Wright: At this point.
Mr. llummner: Are we going to attain the $4,400,000?
Mr. Wright: Tea, we are. In my opinion, we will attain it.
Mr. hummer: Can we attain more?
Mr. Wright: We can attain beyond the $600,000 that we have at this point.
Mr. llumner: Can we attain beyond the $4,400,000?
Mr. Wright: In my prof*asional opinion, we can.
Mr. llugmar: That's what we mood to know, because that is where we are coming
In over budget now. That's the important factor. bow do you suggest that we
can reduce it beyond the $4,400,000?
Mr. Wright: Well, I think that everyone her* has such control over the
station at this point, that as we review the credits that the contractor has
given back to us, we will make aura that we come in below the $4,400,000.
Mr. Plummer: Mr. Manager, are you listening?
Mr.
Odiot Teo. air.-;
Mr.
Plummer: Tou better be listening, because
this is a subject that
Ma *UW
and
I are going to harp on.
t �
Hr.
Odios Well, I just...
11
Mr.
!lingers ?big gentlemen is sailing that
he feels that *Mere
a"
additional credits back beyond the $4,400,000.
Mr.
Odtor Well, wo be" it, as I understand it...
;s
Mr.
Mummers but nobody is listening to his up
to tbis peuml
y
i r 3+'w., `�• ,� i�x� �j �1I
i
tt
U
,'t _-rx
Mr. Odie: (FIRST PART OF STA1SHM NOT PLACn INTO THE MLIC RSCORD)... put
en the agenda to give you a contract, so? Tomorrow.
Mr. Wright: Too.
Mr. Odio: For what is that contract that we are giving?
Mr. Cather: We are giving an additional $30,000 so he may continue.
Mr. Odio: That's right, so he is in fact, working in the project? As I
correct?
( INAVDIiLz STATPUM. )
No. Mirai: vccuse me, Mr. Manager, we need his statements into the public
record.
Mr. Cather: This request for $30,000 additional fees for Mr. Wright is to
have his continue working with us on the value engineering in attempts to make
sure that we save every dims we can possibly save in building this substation,
but at the same, making sure that it moots with the Police Department's
approval an a satisfactory building.
Mr. Odlo: So in fact, he is hired to do that.
Mr. Cather: Too, we have already paid his $120.000.
Mr. Plummer: No, no, the rub is coming, Mr. Manager. You've heard this run
out of your ears, even though it hasn't stuck. Is it in fact, necessary to
allocate the additional monies beyond the $5,000,000, which we have the
probl*a with...
Mr. Odio: He is saying no.
Mr. Plummer: He is saying veal He is saying he can save another $400,000.
Mr. Odio: Tou are saying that?
Mr. Wright: I an...
Mr. Odio: Tou know, I sm going to remind you of that.
Mr. Wright: I an saying that based upon the way the project is going at this
point, that we should be able to come in at the $4,400.000, or below the
$4,400,000.
Mr. Plummer: You are saying beyond the $4.400,000.
Mr. Wright: Yes, I an at...
Mr. Plummer: That's all I as asking.
Mr. Wright: At, or below the $4,400,000.
Mr. Odio: Tine. So since you are going to got a contract tomorrow, you can
continue to do so. Is that what we are talking about?
Mr. Wright: With the help of everyone here, yes.
Mr. Odio: line. OK, then we will see if you can do it. You know, I...
,r
Mr. Plummer: but the question is. Mr. Manager, are we going to IMWO to
allocate more money above the $5,000,000, if this man gas save it?
Mr. Wio: Well, Mbat I suggest us do then, we deter the ttm t~840 i1
allocating more funds, to that substation.
Mr. Dawkins: Me, I dealt want that, so. Do not dstes,aa Itmms '
more money in the substation. I do not want to got 40O."Ogi
substation.
Mr. QOiot Mo. that 10 wbat I Mao, Camissioner. '
e
� kry
0
Mr. Dawkins: OK.
•
Mr. Odiot We were instructed by the Commission to add these funds. The
action tomorrow is just formalising actions taken by the Commission.
Mr. Dawkinat Wail, let's go through with it. If he finds the money, I'd like
to put it back.
Mr. Odiot It he finds lt.....
Mr. Plummer: but that was based on, Mr. Manager, your absolute, by the
department, to us, that there was no other way. Nov, this man is saying that
there is a vayl
Mr. Odio: Yell, let's find out if there is.
Mr. Plummert Mall, I'll tell you how to do it, let's put his on a percentage.
Mr. Davkinst OK, what percentage did he say...
Mr. Plummer: Put him on a percentage, from what he saves below the
$4,400,000.
Mr. Cather: The item which you have asked to be deferred, which I would like
to speak to briefly while I have you here, is the increase over the original
budgeted amount of $5,117,000, on the north sta_lon.
Mr. Plummer: That was never the original budget amount.
Mr. Cathert No, wait. This is the amount as it stands now, that we have
gotten down from the original bid. The original bid was Five million one
something, sae. We've got it down now to $4,400,000. Sven with that
reduction, we still have these other expenses which total to $5,117,000,
Including Mr. Wright and other services for design.
Mr. Plummer: Oaderatand.
Mr. Cather: OK, now, what I am saying to you, we've already let a contract
for this station. Nov, according to the code, as I understand it, we have to
at this time, budget, and have this Commission approve $117,000 more for this,
and $268,000 for this. Now, in the event that Mr. Wright and others save that
amount, it will be returned to this City, but in the meantime, in order to act
legally, as I understand it, we must increase these two things. Nov, if we
can do it without, that's fine.
Mr. Plummer: Don, if you were in the private sector, that would work. In the
public sector, it doesn't work, OK? We would not be in the jackpot we are in
today if that system worked, OK? aecause let me tell you, every one of them
over there, aad every one in your shop who cane in over $5,000,000 would be
fired... would be firedl We gave you instructions clearly, explicitly, over
and over and over - $5,000,000, no morel Give as the key, opening the door.
We couldn't have been any clearer. The taxpayers of this community could not
have been any clearerl You did not do it. You did not do what you were told.
based on that, if you were in the private sector, you're firedl
Mr.
Cather:
Please remember who let the contract, all right?
Mr.
Plummert
May...
Mr.
Cather:
Now. we have picked up, after the bid was
let, and contiaued to
r.
try
to reduce
the cost.,.P
Mr.
Plummo rt
Mey, look, I can't fire you. I can't fire
you. but I awe telli%S
You,
you are
not going to get my vote.
Mr.
Cather:
What I am saying to you is very... I hope,
I vvill. U7 t11.b`
again, is, we have already, after the Public Works %part
�
job
of supervising the design. we have. with the help
of �,# �
and
others, we have reduced the cost by about $900,000.
rx#
y
Mr.
Plusmmer:
You
see...
t:..
,V ,L .
d �„
Mr. Cothert Now, you Csmsiaeiesers let a contract ead handed it to m em a
silver platter, that said, $5,117,000, I man, $3.100,000.
Mr. Dawkins, No, we didn't.
Mr. Plmmmert That's met what we said. Thst's Sot what we said. It guy ►e...
OK, I'll agree that mybe because you are just the supervisor, that you are
Not responsible, OK? gut whoa that contract come in for $5,300,000, it should
have gone back and been re -bided, or reduced is scope to brim it to what we
guaranteed the taxpayers.
Mr. Cothert No argusent.
Mr. Pinmmert Tom sake w lists. Not, you, OK? And I vast to toll you
ses»thing. If this guy came in at $3,900,000, 1 = going to ssbarrass a lot
of people. I still may coat up... I'll tell you what, Mr. Manager, I would
like, whether or colleagues Ogres with sa or sot. shy glues brother...
Mr. Dowkino: Too, I's with you.
Mr. Plumsert ... OK? I want to axe this sus on a percentage of what he Davos,
OK? Tou segotisto it.
Mr. Odiot One percent.
Mr. Plumper: One percent is only $30,000. Give his an incentive.
Mr. Yrightt We will negotiate. Coriseioner !lures, I'd like to state for
the record that I am not doing the deduction alone. I have extressly cospotent
help in the Public Yorks Departstent. It is a tans effort and it is bringing in
the $900,000 that has been saved at this point.
Mr. Plussert Key, you've got to say that right now for the record, because if
you don't, you'll never got one ounce of cooperation frog that point forward,
and I understand that, all right.
Mr. Dawkinst And all we are saying to you is, if they don't cooperate with
you, you don't got so percentage and they may need a job.
Mr. Plummar: Key, I. you know...
Mr. Dawkins: OK, are you adjourning, sir?
Mr. Plummer: Mr. Manager, I fully intend to bring up tosorrow, that this Dan
be hired to im odistely commence start work on the south station.
Mr. Odio: excuse se. time out.
Mr. Dawkins: Now just because he is black, that don't scan he can't work on
the Cuban station, so now lot's get that together. Tou can ahe-be, she -be m
all you want. Just because he is black sow, he can still work on the Cuban
station.
Mr. Plumsort it is not the Cuban station. It is the south station.
Mr. Dawkins: Well all right, he can still work on the Cuban south station.
Mr. Plunnert A lot of Cubans are unhappy with that station.
Mr. Dawkisot Os the Cuban station in the south, whatever.
IMB >iUMI 1101 UMVP AW MI1101 AT 12 o lO P.M. a